City Council · 2017-04-13

CITIESOFOREMANDPROVO
SPECIAL JOINT MEETING
56 North State Street, Orem, Utah
April 13, 2017
This meeting was for discussion purposes only. No action was taken.
CONDUCTING Mayor Richard F. Brunst, Jr.
OREMELECTEDOFFICIALS Mayor Richard F. Brunst, Jr. and Councilmembers Debby
Lauret, Sam Lentz, Tom Macdonald, Mark Seastrand,
David Spencer, and Brent Sumner
PROVO ELECTED OFFICIALS Mayor John Curtis, Councilmembers Dave Harding, Dave
Knecht, Kim Santiago, Dave Sewell, George Stewart, and
Gary Winterton
OREMSTAFF Jamie Davidson, City Manager; Brenn Bybee, Assistant
City Manager; Bill Mr. Bell, Development Services
Director; Jason Bench, Planning Division Manager; Sam
Kelly, City Engineer; Steven Downs, Assistant to the City
Manager; and Jackie Lambert, Deputy City Recorder
PROVOSTAFF Wayne Parker, Chief Administrative Officer; Corey
Norman, Chief Deputy Mayor; Cliff Strachan, Council
Executive Director;
Gary McGinn,  Community
Development Director; David Walter, Redevelopment
Director; Dixon Holmes, Economic Development; David
Graves, City Engineer; Bill Peperone, Redevelopment
Department; Dan Gonzalez, Redevelopment HOME
Management Analyst; and Kelsey Zarbock, Policy Analyst
EXCUSED Councilmembers David Spencer and Brent Sumner
Call to Order
Mayor Brunst called the meeting to order at 12:02 p.m. He invited those in attendance to
introduce themselves to the group.
Items of Common Interest
DISCUSSION - Development along the west 2000 N/2000 S Provo/Orem border and
Integration with Lakeview Parkway
Mr. Goodrich said Lakeview Parkway was still in early planning stages. There was money from
Mountainland Association of Governments (MAG) set aside for 2018 to design the corridor; the
only design they had so far was a line drawn down an aerial photo. He said Orem and Provo
traffic engineers would coordinate for how the alignment would come off the south of Geneva
Joint Orem/Provo City Council Minutes -April 13, 2017 (p.1)

Road and tie in to the parkway. He said UDOT would also be involved because of the tie in to 
Geneva Road. UDOT would be installing a traffic signal at the connection of Geneva Road and 
Orem's 2000 South, but first needed to know the design of the parkway. 
Mayor Brunst asked about the new Provo high school and the roads near it. David Graves, Provo 
Engineer, said they were on schedule for the new school build and they anticipated that the 
school would be open and ready to occupy by August 2018. Mr. Graves said they were working 
to improve traffic flow around the school, but currently were focusing efforts on connecting 
roads at 620 North and out to Geneva Road. They were also working with MAG to find a way to 
acquire right of way there, where Ivory Homes owned a portion of the land and there were other 
challenges. 
Mr. Goodrich said he regularly worked with Mr. Graves and his staff to coordinate. He said the 
first phase would be to get 2000 North out to Geneva Road, because the Orem Lakeview 
Parkway north of that would take some time to build out and finish. 12: 15:56 
Mr. Davidson asked if there were any other questions or concerns about this road connection. He 
said it was important to coordinate on this project and prioritize with both sides, to "eat the 
elephant one bite at a time." 
In response to a question from Provo, Mr. Goodrich said the footprint for the roadway had been 
determined. He showed an overhead map of the area, saying the developer had set aside a 110 
foot wide corridor and an additional 6 feet as an easement for a sidewalk, so the width was there. 
He said there may need to be a discussion in the future about whether the cities should own and 
maintain the road, or if it made more sense to have UDOT take over because they had more 
funds to make it a wider roadway in the future. 
Mr. Knecht asked if that would be through a trade, Geneva Road for the Lakeview Parkway. Mr. 
Goodrich said that was possible. One issue with they kept coming up against was the number of 
historic homes along the roadway, and UDOT was hesitant to take that on. He said there were 
certainly benefits and drawbacks to having the road controlled by UDOT that would need to be 
considered. 
In response to Mayor Brunst's question, Mr. Harding said Geneva Road had some things he 
would like to fix, for example to provide shoulders on sections of the roadway that went through 
Provo. He was interested in seeing the traffic demand models for the area. 
DISCUSSION - Student parking requirements 
Mayor Brunst said Utah Valley University (UVU) was one of the State's largest schools in terms 
of enrollment, if not the largest, and said it was expected to continue to grow by several thousand 
over the coming years. Student housing projects, and parking particularly, was a regular topic of 
conversation in Orem. 
Mr. Goodrich said there were two proposed student housing projects in Orem that were aiming 
for a parking ratio of 0.65 stalls per bed. He had heard that Provo had gone to a higher standard, 
from a 0.7 to a 0.8 parking stalls per bed. He said that since high density parking had been an 
issue in the past, Orem wanted to settle on the right parking ratio for these kinds of projects to 
Joint Orem/Provo City Council Minutes-April 13, 2017 (p.2) 



mitigate problems in the future. He asked for input from Provo on their decision to move the
standardto0.8.
Mr. Peperone said Joaquin Village had been built several years ago in Provo, and immediately
upon occupancy there were complaints from neighbors about the spillover parking problem. It
was intended to be a walkable development so it was built with fewer parking stalls. He
occasionally the area and saw lots of street parking, and heard that there were waiting lists for
residents to get spaces in the parking lot. He said he had spoken with students living in “"the
   n n  o a   s  e   n  o n
park 3 blocks away. Mr. Peperone said 0.8 was a reasonable standard because the parking issues
would only get worse if and when new student housing projects were proposed.
Mr. McGinn said they were trying to figure the exact parking ratio that was needed for students
    n  n      s  
was that areas with fewer parking stalls would attract students that did not use a vehicle, but that
did not always happen. He had observed that in some student housing areas the parking lots
would still have open spaces but the road parking was packed. Mr. McGinn said they did not
regulate the street parking, which surely added to the number of cars there, but students were
opting to park where it was most convenient for them and not necessarily where they should be
parking. These were also areas where the student housing development had been built in the
1940s or 1950s and parking was not an issue then. Street parking continued to be a difficult issue
because it was hard to regulate and was often a politically charged discussion.
Mr. Stewart added that neighbors got angry when high-density developments were built near
them.
Mr. Davidson asked if BYU was willing to help Provo in some of these areas. Mr. McGinn said
they were sympathetic to their concerns, but were not necessarily willing to do anything. Mayor
Curtis added that Provo was grateful for their relationship with BYU, but there were still issues.
They hoped that transit programs like the BRT system would help alleviate some of the pressure
in parking on and around campus.
Mr. Peperone said the street parking issues was not only a problem in neighborhoods but it
affected businesses as well. He said it was common for housing projects to have fewer parking
stalls than beds, but students still brought their cars and parked out on the street.
Mr. Harding added that in raising the standards for parking stalls on new developments they
were in a way penalizing them to subsidize older projects. He said changing the ratio to 0.8 was
an interim solution just trying to stop the problem from getting worse but it was not solving the
create disincentives to bringing a car.
Mayor Brunst said this had been an issue since his time as a BYU student, but it seemed like
Pdu r  i   ss  sse o a ss o n sa 
Joint Orem/Provo City Council Minutes -April 13, 2017(p.3)

Mrs. Santiago agreed that a different approach would be needed, because behaviors were 
difficult to change. Often students were walking to and from campus, but wanted their cars to go 
to the grocery store or to go out on dates. Those were things to consider with future transit. 
Mr. Knecht said they had conducted many studies and even developments with a ratio of 1-to-1 
would still have open spots in the parking lot because parking on the street was easier or closer 
for the student. The other issue was guest parking, because those stalls also needed to be 
included in their thinking. He shared an anecdote of a student intentionally parking where he was 
not permitted, but left a note in the window of the car imploring that they not tow his car because 
he still "paid his tithing" and therefore did not deserve to have his car towed. 
Mr. Macdonald asked if they had considered parking permit areas, as Orem had down around 
UVU neighborhoods. Mrs. Santiago said the permits more often than not ended up punishing 
those residents living in the enforced permit areas. It was harder for guests and family to come 
visit or stay over, and large parties or gathers were an issue. Some would even move out of the 
area to avoid the headache. 
Mr. Lentz wondered if any grocery stores offered grocery delivery. He thought might remove 
some of number of trips to and from a household in a day and change the game. There was some 
discussion on curbside grocery pickup and boutique grocery programs where food/meals were 
sent directly to one's home. 
Mr. Goodrich said he was confused by students not parking in the designated lots and parking on 
the street. Was it that landlords were charging extra for the privilege to park, or the spaces were 
too tight? He did understand the why. Mr. McGinn said all of those things could be part of the 
problem, and students were going to pick the spot that was easiest and felt the safest to them. 
One way to solve that issue was not to allow landlords to charge extra for parking. 
Mr. Seastrand asked if the spillover parking had led to any kind of influx in crime for theft or 
vandalism. Mayor Curtis said only when items were left unlocked and something visible could 
be quickly grabbed. Mr. McGinn added that there was not an increase per capita for crime from 
their studies. 
Mayor Brunst said this was a problem that continue and perhaps get worse, because the 
population was expected to continue to grow. Both Orem and Provo would need to work together 
to find sensible solutions. 
DISCUSSION - CDBG Funding with Senator Orrin Hatch's Office 
Mayor Brunst said there had been some discussion on the national level about eliminating or 
reducing the amounts for the Community Development Block Grant (CDBG) and HOME 
programs. The funds from CDBG went toward programs like the Food and Care Coalition, the 
Children's justice center, literacy programs, Habitat for Humanity, and shelters for homeless and 
women and children in crisis. They were hoping to reach out to the President through U.S. 
Senator Orrin Hatch's office. Ron Dean, a representative from Orrin Hatch's office was present 
to address both councils. 
Joint Orem/Provo City Council Minutes -April 13, 2017 (p.4) 



Mr. Dean said CDBG and the HOME programs were tremendously popular in Congress, and
both sides saw the good these funds would do in the hands of local governments. He said that
most people believed the funding would be fully in place this year, but there were concerns into
the future. CDBG funds helped serve those groups or programs that were necessary but were not
necessarily self-sustaining. If they wanted to voice support or share anecdotes of how this
funding had been beneficial in years past, Mr. Dean asked that they send them to Dianne
Browning in his office at dianne_browning@hatch.senate.gov.
Mrs. Santiago asked if a joint resolution from both city councils would be helpful in showing
their support for these programs. Mr. Dean said that certainly wouldn't hurt. He emphasized that
clear, anecdotal information was going to be very helpful in showing how these funds blessed the
lives of those in poverty or crisis. The specifics helped put stories to the funding, which was
powerful.
Mr. Strachan said he would work with Mr. Downs on the joint resolution.
Mr. Seastrand said receiving CDBG funding lent these programs the credibility they needed to
encourage private donations.
Mr. Stewart said they needed to be transparent about what CDBG funding went toward. He said
only 50 percent to social services and the rest was going to development.
Mr. Norman said business development still benefitted those in need. Mr. Dean added that they
should show the nexus of development to the line of reducing poverty.
Mr. Knecht said the trickle-down effect of economic development into job creation and home
rehabilitation was why the funding was portioned the way it was. In the end it was to help low-
income people find jobs, homes, or the help they needed.
Review Date and Time for Next Meeting
The next meeting was scheduled for July 13, 2017, at noon in Provo.
Adjournment
Mr. Lentz moved to adjourn the meeting. Mayor Brunst seconded the motion. The motion
passed unanimously.
The meeting adjourned at 1:18 p.m.
Joint Orem/ProvoCityCouncilMinutes-April 13,2017(p.5)

mmaR.Olaver
Donna R.Weaver, City Recorder
Approved:May9,2017
OREM
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JointOrem/ProvoCityCouncilMinutes-April13,2017（p.6)