City Council · 2019-06-18

I'd like to begin. We do have a quorum.

1, 2, 3, 4.

Excuse me, I forgot to count you. Sorry, I was counting heads.

We're still missing 3, but we do have a quorum and we'll go ahead and start. So our first is a presentation on the State Street mobility update with Sam Kelly and Avenue Consultants. Sam, maybe you can introduce the gentleman with you.

Is that Blake?

Yeah, this is Blake with Avenue. He's going to be Just giving the City Council an update on where we're at with our mobility study.

We have 15 minutes.

Okay, thank you.

Appreciate being here. We, for the better part of last year and starting out again this year, we've been studying Orange State Street. We've been here a couple times to talk to you guys about the study that's been going on. We're actually at the point where we're going to be implementing this plan. Just to kind of refresh your memory on where we were at, the Orem State Street corridor master plan was approved by the City Council back in 2015, and this project, this Orem State Street Mobility Study, is a first step in implementing the master plan. And so it's kind of a fun project to be part of because it's actually realizing some of the, some of the vision that's coming out of the Orem State Street corridor master plan. A little bit of background on the project. The funding was requested by Orem City, and MAG awarded Orem City about $1.3 million to do this project, and UDOT pitched in $2.4 million. And part of that was to do the study, and some of that is to actually implement improvement projects.

The study of—

the focus of this study was safety. Primarily to reduce crashes, and also mobility, which looked at reducing delay, it looked at accommodating storage or accommodating queues a little bit better, and also looking at increasing connectivity. And the study, this study that was done in the last half of 2018, identified solutions that were fundable, first off, we had the money to do it. Second, defensible, we had the data to support it. And third, timely, something that we could implement.

Thank you.

Fairly quickly. And I wanted to just kind of give a little bit of background also on the coordination between Orem City and UDOT for this project. There's been a lot of good coordination. We have— we actually established a steering committee, and we had several steering committee meetings that were actually milestones for the project where decisions were being made. And that steering committee was made up of Orem City staff and also UDOT staff, where we collaborated together. And and helped make decisions along the way, including prioritizing projects for construction. Then we also had a couple city council updates. This is the third, and we appreciate the opportunity to come in and talk with you about it. And Paul actually had a couple instances where he was able to update the City Transportation Commission of the progress of the project, of the study. And then finally, we've had an Orem City UDOT MAG leadership meeting that occurred last year. To talk about the study and what resulted in the study. So there's been a lot of great coordination between Orange City and UDOT. The study resulted in projects at 7 locations. And as you can imagine, a lot of the issues, the safety issues and the mobility issues, occur around intersections where there's a lot of congestion. You see a lot of crashes, you see a lot of queuing issues. And these were the 7 intersections that were identified as having the most congestion and the worst types of crashes, or a combination thereof. And you can kind of look through there. As we went through, we looked at the funding that was available for these intersections. And as we were looking at improvements, we were looking at things like extending left and right turn storage pockets, incorporating raised medians with strategic breaks, creating 3/4 accesses, which is left in but not left out. You can't turn left out, but you can turn left in. And if you You can do right in, right out. Also looking at consolidating closing accesses, adding right-turn pockets, and also in one instance we looked at relocating a traffic signal, which you're probably aware of. As we were looking at these— at all these improvements and how they were affecting the issues and helping the issues out there, the steering committee and the project team identified 3 locations that we could prioritize and actually implement based on the funding that was available. And those were University Parkway, Center Street, and 800 North. And these other 4 right here, they have projects associated. We have concept layouts, we have ideas for improvements, but those were going to be addressed at a future date when funding is available. So they're there ready to go, they just need funding. These other 3, the first, University Parkway, right now based on what's going on out there, we're actually looking at Doing a little bit more traffic study out there to understand circulation around the mall area, University Parkway, and 800 South, 800 East, or 300— 800 East and University Parkway.

How many South?

What's that?

You say 300 South? 800 South.

And 800 East.

800 East, yeah, that whole big quadrant, right? To kind of understand the circulation around that area and understand how people are getting in and out of that area with the Costco and the mall and everything.

So let me ask you another question. as you go through. I had understood that part of this money was going to be used for medians down State Street.

Yes.

And you're identifying intersections. Are you identifying State Street from University Parkway to Center Street to North 800 North as part of this?

So that's a great question. Your question is, uh, whether— where we're identifying—

Are we including State Street in this? Well, you're doing—

this is, this is all State Street, yes.

Okay, but the medians would be Running from University Parkway to Hayes North?

Not with this project. Not with this project. We're starting to extend the medians, and I'll show you kind of an example of what that looks like as I get into it. But we're starting to extend the medians down in areas where there are incidents like angled crashes or crashes that can be mitigated by the implementation.

Because I understood we were going to have some medians that could have landscaping somewhat similar to what 8th North has had in a similar design, only going north and south.

Yeah, and so that's ultimately the goal, I think. And Paul's done a good job of kind of reminding us that that's one of the goals of the city, is to implement these.

In fact, your first slide—

I don't know if that's the next one—

kind of showed—

no, it's not. Oh, right.

Yeah, yeah. And we'll kind of— I'll cover a little bit about that. We're not—

we're—

this project didn't look at extending the medians across the entirety of State Street, rather looking at I just thought the $2.4 million from UDOT included doing those medians along State Street with landscaping. Yes, and that's the plan. That's the plan, is to include raised medians on there. We're looking at right now, we're in the phase of looking at where we can actually fit some landscaping with the medians.

So that's a great question.

You have about 600 apartments on 4th South.

Why is that left off?

So there wasn't really a— there was a need there, it just didn't outweigh the need of all these other locations. So we looked at it from a crash standpoint, from a traffic standpoint, and to see which had the worst congestion and which had the worst, you know, the most number of crashes that we could mitigate with the goals of the project. And so 4th South was on there, it just wasn't as as heavy as— didn't have as many issues as these other streets.

So we need more crashes at 4th South?

Well, more congestion as well. I wouldn't like encourage crashes. Would you like to do your part?

What, Brett?

Maybe you could do your part to—

Yeah, but that's, that's, you know, our goal was to increase safety and to help mobility. And 4th South, although it did have— it was, you know, the intersections are always going to be an area of concentration. 4th South wasn't as Didn't have as many issues as these other locations.

You just had all those apartments right there.

Yeah, yeah. So you'd think that there would be more, but the data didn't show that, so.

It's due to the new left turn lane we have off of 4 South onto State Street that we don't have the crashes. It's known as the Brent Sumner— it's right turn lane.

Oh, the right turn lane.

Okay, gotcha.

The Brent Sumner Expressway.

So, um, so the idea is University Parkway, we're going to do some additional study and we're going to take the design to 30% and clear Clear an environmental footprint so that it's ready to go when additional funds are available. We go and implement University Parkway. I'll show you what that looks like here in just a second. We're also going to be doing some coordination with the businesses around that area in the mall, the Woodburys and whatnot. The other 2, Center Street and 8th North, these 2 are actually going to be carried forward and constructed next year is the plan. And so right now we're currently in design and we are working on the environmental clearance. So the goal is to have the design wrapped up this year and right-of-way starting to get purchased for those projects and then implemented next year and constructed. So let me kind of walk you through this real quick. I know I'm running out of time. This is University Parkway. Here's a map. We're putting everything to the north and to the right because it just fits better. State Street fits better on a map.

If I could just add something to help answer the question. So this location at 1400 South Was our highest accident location at an unsignalized intersection. So not only were we having a lot of accidents at that intersection, but we have a tremendous amount of traffic congestion around the parkway. So one of the things we're doing is making the left turn lanes longer. And if you look at all of this area right here, this is an area where some landscaping could occur. Now our MAG money specifically is going to help go towards the landscaping, whereas the UDOT money has some funding restrictions where it doesn't go towards landscaping.

So just, just like Paul said, the goal was to kind of identify those areas where there was issues and then implement something that would help resolve those issues.

But again, this whole area right here, this is the area where we're going to do more traffic analysis because there's so much growth happening in the mall and Some of that area where we've done some rezoning in the State Street node. We really need to know more about how traffic is going to be working in that area before we—

So you're going to eliminate left-hand turns from State Street onto 1400 South?

Yep, it needs to become a right-in, right-out.

Because that's a pretty heavily used left-hand turn area.

Yes, it is a heavily—

here's the thing though, again, Is that this is part of our master plan, having the raised medians with the— I mean, we have accesses so often along State Street, we can't have raised medians with planters without having some intersections go to right-in, right-out.

Sure, I was just trying to verify if that's what you're saying.

Yes, that's correct. That's what the proposal is at that location.

And part of the issue here at University Parkway is that we don't have enough space for left turns to store up right now. So part of this is to extend that left turn storage back. In so doing, we don't have enough space to actually put in a left turn for 400 to 1400 South. And not to mention, like, you know, what Paul said about the crashes out here, they're pretty, you know, pretty excessive.

Yeah, part of the problem is too, is if you go in there, and a lot of people just avoid this intersection at all costs, but part of the problem is, is in peak hour traffic Sometimes those left— the people who want to get in a left turn, the left turn lanes are so short that they're stuck in a through lane and they're messing up traffic who wants to, you know, be able to move through the community and they can't do that. So one of the things that we're doing is making those left turn lanes longer and getting rid of what we call a queue starvation. You know, it's happening at Center Street, it's happening at 8th and North, it's happening at Parkway. So again, it's not just the accidents, but how much congestion can we resolve by just doing some median treatments differently? You know, and some of those medians were probably installed in the '80s and '90s, and they're just not functioning the way they should for today's traffic.

Paul, to be clear, the mayor said 1400 South, not 400 South.

1400 South is the application area.

I misunderstood it.

The map said 1400.

I thought I heard I just wanted to clarify.

One question too, though. You have Movetta on the right there, on this side, but you also have Chuck-A-Rama on the west side. And I don't know, are we going to talk to the businesses and let them know?

We have been doing that. This is— yeah, we did that a lot extensively in the first phase of the project. We're going to do that again in the second face. And I'm a huge Checkorama fan, but I can tell you right now that I do not make left turns at that intersection because it's kind of like you take that in, you're like— and there are other alternatives to be able to get back and forth to Checkorama, and I can give you ideas if you need ideas.

And that's part of what we heard from our public outreach effort is that the community says, I try to find— I try to avoid State Street. I'm going to find other routes to get to where I'm going. And so, and mainly because it's congested and it's confusing and not predictable. And this actually creates a more predictable environment, you know, because if you think of all these driveways along here and this center turn lane and how people are getting in and out of the center turn lane, that's scary to people as they're out there driving around. And so they try to avoid this area altogether. And sometimes pushing them away from the city altogether. We heard that people will go up to other cities because they just don't want to come down to Orem State Street because it's too crazy and congested.

So going north, how do you get to Chuck Around?

There's no left turn lanes on there.

Do a right and then another right.

Yeah, yeah. So there's, you know, the nice thing that Orem City is set up, there's a nice grid system, right? And so the idea is with the grid system, there's a couple things that we're trying to work with. is to have people utilize that grid system. So maybe turn at 1500 or go up to University Parkway and go around the block. But then we're also looking at areas where we can allow U-turns. So U-turns are going to be when you start looking at things like this, which is, you know, kind of that focus of that State Street corridor master plan, is to get more, you know—

So are you allowing a U-turn on the Parkway?

Well, that's one thing that we're going to study. We're going to look at that. We haven't— that's something that we've got to work with UDOT on and kind of figure out to see if that's an option. But it's looking at those traffic volumes and trying to figure out how that will operate with that right turn coming off of University Parkway right here. So that's pending, and we're going to start looking at that kind of stuff. But the goal is to kind of start utilizing that grid-like infrastructure to, um, to get people around Orem City, but then also provide a safer environment for, uh, for State Street while kind of progressing that master plan for State Street to look—

start looking at opportunities for, you know, transit and stuff like that on here.

So, um, I think I might be out of time. You—

can I—

How many slides have you got?

So we got the— I wanted to kind of talk about University Parkway, um, and then also like the North End, and then the other 2 locations, just so you can see what we're doing.

You can do it in 6 minutes?

6 minutes, yep.

So here's the north leg of University Parkway. Here it is right here. The goal of this one is to extend that southbound left turn storage length. Right now it's super deficient. There's a lot of southbound left turners that are going east on University Parkway, and so we want to extend that out. But the problem is that 1200 South is in the way, that intersection right there, that signal. And so— And you guys are very aware of this. It's been probably talked about a lot, is to move this traffic light from 1200 South to 1150 South. And then also look at extending that median up to 1000 South. And one of the big issues out here is that there's so many driveways, there's a lot of angled crashes. In fact, this segment right here had the most angled crashes on State Street, period. And so this helps that issue.

Thank you.

So a real quick question, maybe it's to Jamie, but if you go across the street, we had discussed one time buying some of the buildings and extending the road over. How does this play into it, or we don't have the money to do it right now?

And that, you know, and I'll defer to Paul, that remains part of the conversation. Not within the scope of this effort, but we still see this as a As a future possibility, correct?

Is that—

Yeah, our long-range plan is to get an access over to Orem Boulevard, but there's a lot more analysis that we need to do in working with the property owners in that area and finding funding. Plus, yes, it is our long-range plan.

Plus, it does require obviously the acquisition of a lot of right-of-way, and that is Right, so we've got to figure out a financial path forward for that particular effort as well.

But this would be a first phase, moving the traffic signal up, getting the Parkway intersection to work a lot better. And then if you can kind of picture where Park Avenue ties over to 800 East, we're also going to need to have a city project where we put a signal, traffic signal, on that end. But that's part of what we're going to In the funding that we have for this. Again, this is— we're just going to get to a 30% design level. We're going to get an environmental clearance so we can go get some additional funding and make sure that everything in that area, that we understand how all of the traffic flows in that whole area.

And I don't know if we specifically mentioned it, and if I did— we did, I apologize— but this was something that was specifically discussed and agreed upon with Woodbury Corporation years ago in the development of the CDA, there was always acknowledgement that this signal would shift to 1150 from its current location right out in front of the police department.

And that's one of the reasons why they took down the Murbans and had that road built between, you know, 800 East and State Street. So it's been a long-term plan, and it's been in the process for a long time, and this This is a potential first phase where we can have traffic.

And again, this area right here is going to be taken to 30% design, and then the environmental footprint's going to get cleared.

And that's the—

and then when funding is available to do the rest, we'll do it, and then it'll get implemented.

Did you have something else?

No, go ahead. Okay.

So Center Street, this is Center Street. Here's Orem City right here on the northeast corner. We got Smith's and McDonald's. We're looking at Improving the southwest and north legs. The city currently has a plan to improve the east leg, and so we're not doing anything on the east leg. And the goal here is to extend— at this intersection in particular, you're probably aware that there's a lot of left turns in all directions, and so we're going to be extending all the left turn storage pockets at this intersection. And I'll tell you, the operational benefits of doing just this type of improvement at this intersection are just fantastic. We actually see about 23 seconds of delay improvement for this intersection when we implement something like this, which is a big deal for an intersection. That's per vehicle, 23 seconds per vehicle. Down here, this is the west leg right here with north being kind of that way, just so you kind of see what's going on. And then I'm just going to kind of move through because I'm almost done with my 6 minutes here. 800 North, Is the final one. This is, uh, we're going to be improving the north and the south legs of this intersection. Part of what we're doing is this southbound left turn pocket is, is really heavy. We've got a really heavy left turn right here to go east on 800 North. We're extending that out and then also limiting the access here on that north end of the Macy's property. Here's Macy's right here.

Closing that access is is one of the best things you could ever do.

So that's—

I don't even know how that ever got through.

Yeah, so we've actually worked with Wells Fargo and with Woodburys on this type of improvement to close this access. Wells Fargo actually owns the access.

They've got about 2 to 3 cars from the intersection and they all stack up back in the intersection.

Where are you looking at closing?

The very first one.

So it's that first access right off of the main street.

Can you point to it on the map?

Yeah, right here.

There's one there?

Yep, there's an access right in front of Starbucks.

Thank you, sir.

And so the problem is, and we actually looked at this crash data here, there's a lot of rear-end collisions through this intersection, which we know is partially due to this. And so closing that, we're also actually adding a right turn pocket as well to get people from the travel lanes into this right turn pocket, which creates a safer environment, and then to turn right into the BCC.

In our public involvement process, that was the Their number one complaint is, please fix that.

Like I said, I don't know how that ever got approved in the first place. I'll blame it on God.

Okay.

Yes, didn't have your watchful eye. So we're also improving these right-turn pockets here just to kind of extend them out a little bit without impacting the businesses, physically impacting the businesses. So, um, one last thing that I want to talk about is, uh, our upcoming outreach. We are planning a bunch of one-on-one visits with the businesses, so we're going to be out talking to the businesses. You're likely going to hear a little bit from them as we're going out there and talking to them. We're going to have, as part of the environmental process, a public open house at each of the locations, so University Parkway and/or North and Center Street. And then we're going to continue to update the Orem Forum and send out emails to people that have been giving us their email information. The businesses and the residents that we work with. We've done a lot of outreach in 2018, and we're going to carry that forward into 2019. And one thing that I want to just bring up is we have a project communications team. So if you, if you as the City Council, Mayor, if you hear from the public, feel free to forward that on to our project communications team because there's a couple things that's important for us on this project. Number one, from an environmental standpoint, We need to record that information, the feedback from the public. That's part of the environmental process. Number two is we want to try to keep the message consistent and accurate. So we'd love to be the ones that take that burden from you. If you feel like it's a burden, send that to us.

We'd love to.

You know, our communications team, they'd love to take on and respond to the people who are getting in contact with you. It's also important for us to understand who is. who is interested in and has concerns about this project so we can go follow up with them individually. So that's really important. And then we, again, we need to provide that documentation. So please write down this information, contact us if you hear from the public. And I think I'm a little over. I used 6 minutes. I think there was other— Paul had a few minutes.

No, you're good.

Anyway, we appreciate—

yeah.

So when you do the one-on-one visits with the businesses, do you also talk to the property owners, like the landlords essentially?

Yep.

Yeah, yeah, because, you know, the goal is to get everybody who's involved on that property in those dialogues because, you know, that the business may not be there long term, but that property owner may, you know, have to deal with whatever's—

that's a good question.

Yeah.

Is the goal, end goal, to eliminate Parking along State Street?

Um, not on this—

On-street parking? On-street parking.

That's a, that's a good question. I, you know, is that— that may be part of the Orange State Street Master Plan. In this case, there wasn't a need in this—

I don't remember, but I don't remember that much. I mean, the document's that thick, but this is the first phase.

If you wake up in the morning and all the curbs are red, you'll know Paul's been out there.

But I do think, I do think, Brent, it is fair As part of that process and the introduction of potentially transit and such along the corridor, there was a conversation as to the future of on-street parking along State Street.

It's expensive parking. We need the streets back.

Yeah, so I mean, I don't want to say to you parking is not going to be restricted ever on State Street. I do anticipate a time, if for example we were to proceed with some of these transit options, that that conversation would be part of the overall plan forward. And whether or not there could be, you know, parking pockets left, that's different than just broadly eliminating parking along the entire corridor.

So Blake, you've kept to your minutes. We've just added a few.

So thank you very much. Appreciate it. Thank you, Sam and Paul.

We'll now go to a presentation from Sam and Mary Delamare Schaefer, our UTA Regional General Manager, on our UDX update.

I'm here also with our UTA Trustee Kent Millington, and he's gonna come and share, talk about some next steps. This is going to be the nothing but good news Story for you all, and I just have to say, I first thing when I walked in, thank you very much. I like coming back to Orem. This is where I started my public service career, and I sat in Brent's office in 1982. I was ten. Anyway, I always had a child labor issue that said it was a different law back then. So I love coming. I'm going to go back to Orman. I want to go through— we have handouts for you that we're going to go through really quickly and share some data.

So— Thank you.

This shows our ridership in the Timpanogos Business Unit, which is Utah County. And when you look at the blue line, that's before UVX. That was our ridership. And I wanted you to be able to see the curve. We have a natural curve due to the student population here in the community. The red line is what happened this year. So you see that sharp upturn is when we— in August when we opened UVX, and we opened under construction as you well know, probably one of the best decisions we made because the students learned to ride UVX right away. You can't turn that tide. And what's really interesting to us is you follow over here and you see this year, I'm going to show you in a minute that we know how— we did a survey on board so we know what the population is that's riding UVX. 84% of them are students. So I had a lot of fear and dread in my heart what was going to happen when they left school. And in May we went to— we had 7,000 average weekday boarders.

That's a lot.

Our height during the school year was 9,900 average weekday boardings. So for us, that's a phenomenal number to see that kind of ridership, and it's still 3 times what we had before we started UVX. Hey Steve, you want to go to the next one? These are all our bus routes, just to give some idea, except for UVX. We've had some modest increases. You'll take note of 850, which is our State Street bus. We've had some increases there. We had a drop in the 8:41, that's the shuttle from Orem/Frontrunner to UVU. That's because they were getting on UVX. And let me show you what happened on UVX. So here's the good news story about UVX. What our goal was is to hit 11,000 average boardings per day 2 years out. We are not a year out yet and we've already hit, like I said, 9,900 average weekday boardings. What's really exciting is that, so those bus routes that you just saw on the previous slide before UVX, collectively that was 2.4 million boardings in a year. We've just hit 2 million boardings on UVX alone. So we would anticipate, and by the time we get to the fall and we've hit a year on UVX, we've probably doubled the ridership on transit in Utah County.

Yay!

So this might be a dumb question, but you're You're not collecting fare, so how are you keeping track of all these people coming on and off?

So we have laser counters that count who's coming on and how they— and when they come on and when they come off. And then we do some kind of magical mathematical formula to make sure that it's statistically sound, and there's a whole lecture that goes with that, so that we make sure we get a sound number of who's riding. And I'm going to tell you how we know who's riding. So next slide. We did a statistically sound onboard survey, which means we had employees from UTA go out I think over about a week period, Scott, Scott Bingham is our analyst, does all our numbers. And they went different times a day and they asked people, who are you, a student, are you with BYU or UVU, are you a community member, what's going on? And so we know 46% of the ridership is from UVU, 38% from BYU, that surprised us. So we did not have, we've had a longstanding contract with UVU and they've been riding for a number of years. BYU has not had a long-term contract with us, and they immediately jumped on and started riding transit. So the next slide. This is just to show you, we looked at who was riding from BYU, and we had 90% of them are from students. Do the next slide. We had a 31— over 3,100% increase in ridership at BYU. So that's again where you see we didn't have a contract with them before, and so we didn't have good measurement. On to UVU, UVU, 96% of them are students. We see less faculty. We think that's because there's a lot of adjunct faculty at UVU, as Professor Seestrand could tell us, and they are not able to ride transit, we think. We think that's what's going on there. But UVU had 103% increase. Now why this is important is because I had a bet with Val Peterson. Y'all know Val Peterson over at UVU?

Yes.

He said, I want to see a 20% increase. I said, you're going to see a 100% increase right out of the chute.

That's good.

He's happy. So here are all of our stations, and what's super important right here to me is the ridership at UVU. That's our highest ridership station on the UVX system, is the students flocking over to UVU. We have— this is the It's not showing up on our slide, but how much is it? There it is. Okay, so of the 1.7 million boardings, we see over 700,000 in the stations on UVX in Orem City, and that's super interesting to me because you see how many more stations we have in Provo, and yet we're capturing that kind of audience in Orem. We also know that the students are living in Provo And going to school at UVU, you all know that as you add more student housing, and that's certainly happening, we'll see those numbers change as more students are living by campus.

Mary, the mayor just noted, and I think this is worthy to just note, the boardings at University Place compared to Town Center and Provo.

Oh, well, that is something you would notice, Mayor. That's kind of—

Yes.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Huge.

That's one of our biggest transfer points too for buses. People are getting off there and transferring to other buses.

4 to 5 times.

It's nice, right?

Okay.

So also interesting is when the student passes started in August, we saw them going all over the system. So they have to tap onto the little standards that we have when they go onto TRAX or Frontrunner or on a bus, and we can track them. And what we like is that the Provo and the Orem stations and Lehi all took a jump after the student passes started. So Frontrunner is certainly getting heavily used, and if you want to do something fun, at least I think it's fun, is if you go during the school year and you're on the Orem platform, Frontrunner platform, or the Provo Frontrunner platform, you'll see the mass exodus to UVX, and those buses are full. And so it's fun to just see how that system happens, and so quickly students It wasn't hard for them to figure out how to use that and how to make that a part of their commute. I'm going to turn over to Trustee Millington and let him talk a little bit about our next steps, which you all are very heavily involved in.

One of the most important things that we try to do at UTA is to provide these good bus services, which we have here in Utah County, as opposed to the tracks that's available in Salt Lake County. So one of the things that we've done is that we have engaged a world-class consultant to help us take a look at what we call our service choices. The service choices really boil down to 2 things. Do we concentrate our limited assets in ridership or coverage? Do we try to promote Frequent service along the corridors that have the highest ridership possibilities, or do we try to reach out to the other areas of our county that may not have such a high ridership? And let me demonstrate how that might work. With our service choices, we've held a number of workshops. We've encouraged people to go to to our website and respond. There's just been a major effort the last 3 or 4 months to get input. That input now is being analyzed, and towards the end of the summer, we will, we will begin to make some proposals as to changes that may need to be started as a result of what we've discovered. Let me show you a possibility here, both in the ridership and then in coverage. Let's go to this slide. This is our 850, our Route 850, which is basically State Street from Provo to Lehi. And all— every stop along the way is listed. You'll notice all of the stops here in Orem. This happens to be University Place right here.

University Place.

You can see down here at the Provo station, you can see Lehi station, and they shoot up simply because you've got the Frontrunner connections as well. But this is basically a lot of ridership. Look at the entire route from Provo to Lehi is covered. This is a heat map showing where people get on. And so all along that corridor, there are people getting on. Now right now we're at about 30-minute headways.

It's more like 15.

15?

15 on State Street? So we're at 15 here, and so we see a lot of ridership. So the question is, do we in our service choices increase the frequency along the corridor that has a lot of ridership? Or do we try to then extend our service into other parts of the county? Let's go to the next slide. The next slide shows Route 821. Notice it starts in Payson and goes up to Provo. But notice that there's very little ridership. In fact, 850 along State Street has about 2,500 a day.

That's a lot.

That boardings along State Street. This one along from Payson to Provo only has about 200 a day. So it's significantly less. But notice there are big gaps here, which you did not see along State Street.

There are big gaps.

But it's still serving a lot of people. A couple hundred a day. And so this is more the coverage. Do we deploy assets in this way, or do we decrease asset usage here, and so that we can put other assets in ridership? That's what we have to determine. And we illustrate that right here in Utah County by looking at State Street. We're looking from Payson to So, yes, ma'am.

So I know, having spent some time out in Saratoga Springs, that they're very concerned because they have a bus in the morning, a bus in the afternoon, and they would like a lot more service. And I have no idea what the ridership is. My question would be is just how you're going to determine your priorities. Is it going to be ROIs? Is it going to be ridership? And maybe you haven't decided that yet.

Well, we haven't completely decided that yet. That's part of what we're trying to determine now. That's part of the input that we're seeking. And we've done the same thing in Saratoga Springs and Eagle Mountain that we've done here in Oroville, to find out what their feelings are.

Do you find the routes that are busier with more ridership, like the The one that you mentioned on State Street.

State Street.

Are those— do those tend to coincide with congested roadways versus this road from Provo down to Payson? Is there less traffic, less congestion that this would be competing with?

Yes, and there's fewer people. As you might anticipate, there are just not that many people along the way to get on those buses. And so the fact is that ridership would be along your more congested roadways.

So I guess my initial inclination would be that if you're prioritizing the ridership and the frequency of those routes, you're going to be doing more to help alleviate congestion as opposed to— and not that we shouldn't help those people that are in these more remote areas.

See, that's the difficult—

that's correct, but that's the difficult decision that we're faced with. We've got a limited number of assets that we can deploy, and we've got to figure out What's the best way to serve the communities, the growing communities that we have in all of our regions, all the way from Payson to Brigham City? So all of that has to be determined, and we're working through those kinds of things right now. That's, that's the dilemma that we're facing, and that's part of the reason we're engaging a consultant to help us think that through.

I imagine if you visit Orem or Provo, you're probably going to hear that message, whereas if you visit—

If we visit Saratoga Springs or Eagle Mountain, we're going to hear a different deal. And the same is true, I also represent, besides representing Utah County on the Board of Trustees, I represent Tooele County. And we're really increasing our service from Tooele County into Salt Lake City. And we hear the same kinds of concerns out there.

My firm belief is the reason, one of the major reasons UVX is successful is that it was done collaboratively. Orem City, Provo, Tooele County, BYU, UVU. And the people that it affected, I know because we spent a lot of time together in Orem City, really working through to make sure it fit the community. And going forward, that's how we're going to find success, is that making sure that UTA doesn't that stand alone and make these choices. As Ken's talked about, it's very collaborative to bring people in and help us collectively as community members make these choices. Jamie Davidson is leading out on our next potential UVX along State Street. He gathered up all the cities in North County. UDOT is going to be the project manager on the Central Corridor Study. We're getting proposals this week. We also got cities to chip in more money. So your Imagine Orem work is really setting the pace for everyone else in the county. And the staff did a presentation to the rest of the northern county cities so they could learn about how that process worked and how to prepare. You all are prepared for transit. Not all the other cities have prepared for transit. So it doesn't make sense until they do some land use things and make some other choices.

But isn't it becoming more visible? The success is becoming more visible, and people are saying, this actually does work, this is something we should be doing.

I can, I can tell you that we've had delegations from Ogden and from Bountiful, both Weber County and Davis County, come down and ride UVX. They've been here to actually see the success. because they're looking at similar systems, especially in Ogden. We're very actively pursuing that one from the Ogden FrontRunner station up to Weber State and over to the hospital. And they've been down here riding UVX to see how it works.

That's exciting.

And it was really interesting that Val Peterson was the one that was telling the people from Weber State, you're crazy if you don't do this.

That's awesome.

That is interesting.

Yeah, that's awesome.

I think one of the interesting things too, that the mayor sometimes finds himself in the awkward position. A lot of the revenue generated obviously for these UTA projects is by way of sales tax. So when we have these conversations countywide, Orem is a very significant participant in that sales tax discussion. And so while individual cities may be interested in having for example, access to service, their percent of contribution to the overall UTA system is significantly different, generally significantly less than program norm, right? And so, you know, Mayor kind of balances that conversation by saying, look, coverage is important, but at the same time, you need to kind of remember where this money is being generated from. And quite frankly, the City of Orem was a, one of the, I guess you could say, founding fathers of UTA in Utah County. Whereas even some of our partner cities here in the county, they were mandated into UTA a number of years ago. And so the level of commitment that Orem has made to UTA is very, very strong. Decades long strong versus some of our other communities in and around the valley where they've only been in for a number of years. So—

We recognize that. That's part of the reason why when we get— begin to get these results from this service choices study that we've done, we're going to be sitting down very carefully with all of the cities and the counties and going over this because we need that additional input as we make decisions. About where to run buses and how frequently and all of that.

Mark, and then back over here. I think one of the—

sorry, Sam was first, but not to lay it on too heavy, but just another aspect of, you know, focusing on frequency and where there's already congestion. If you're, if you're taking cars off the road where there already is congestion, you're not just serving those people riding the bus, but you're serving the people who are left on the road. Whereas if You know, I don't think that it might be that some of the more rural areas where there's not the same level of congestion, there's really not as much of a benefit to those that are not actually riding.

Let me guess that you would propose that we concentrate on ridership as opposed to—

No, I don't want to put words in your mouth.

That's a great suggestion.

Yeah, I'm glad we incepted that idea there.

Some of that coverage though has to do with people who don't have any other way to get And I'm really quite intrigued with first and last mile solutions.

The mainline is one, it's running great. It's how do we get people to and from their home there or to their place of business. So I kind of like, at least if I look at Orem, we've got, I mean, many junctions. I like the idea of—

One of the things that we are trying that UTA started this fall I like that. It's what we call a mini transit in southeastern or southwestern Salt Lake County— Herriman, Bluffdale, Draper, Riverton, that area— to solve this last mile, first and last mile problem, not with big buses running through neighborhoods, but with smaller vans or smaller buses or even an Uber-type We're going to try that and see what happens. Of course, we'll share all those results with people as we get the results over the next several months.

And we're just about out of time. I don't know how you're doing.

We're good.

Okay, well, thank you very much. Appreciate it. I was going to say it's been a great partnership with UTA to put all this together. UDOT, you know, MEG, different cities.

It's been We appreciate that very much.

Mayor, may I just make a note to Barry and Trustee Millington that as part of your budget this current— or this next fiscal year, you have approved an appropriation to provide employees access to the UTA system consistent with, for example, UVU and BYU employees and students, not their dependents because that's a little bit of a different situation. different program, but our employees will now have the choice as to whether or not to use transit.

They already have access to the bus.

This is for the Frontrunner is what you're making reference to. Well, everyone at UVolks is free right now.

Yes, it would be— they would have access, all of our employees would have free access to the UTA network system.

Outside of Utah County as well?

Everywhere.

Everywhere we go.

Yes.

So we have citizens who's contracted.

I bet you I didn't answer it.

In fact, one of the months you did anyway, in advance of your contract, we sent out surveys.

Okay, yeah, all right.

So thank you very much, uh, to Mary and Peter, uh, Scott and Kent. We'll now move on to our sales tax leakage. If we could have it quiet, we're going to move on to our next section. And we have Kathy Beckett and Susie Becker. That's Susie right there. Sure, go ahead.

Good afternoon, Mayor, and members of the City Council, and those in attendance. I'm Kathy Beckett, interim economic development manager here at the city, and I'm here today to introduce Benj Becker from Zients Public Finance Municipal Consulting Group. And Benj today is going to present to us the 2018 sales tax leakage and capture rates And those, that information is found in the City of Orem Economic Development Strategic Plan. And just as a reminder, that strategic plan was updated and approved, or was approved in 2014. And at that time—

What's his name again?

I'm sorry.

Ben Specker.

And at that time, the City of Orem was the retail hub for Utah County. And we're going to show today The 2018 data that shows that Orem is still the regional hub for Utah County. And just by way of information, um, introduction, Benj previously worked for 10 years in San Francisco at a real estate advisory firm, and for the past 5 years he's been involved in Utah and Intermountain region real estate and economic development markets, and he He's currently the Vice President of Municipal Consulting for Zions Bank. Now, if you look at Benj and you think he might look a little bit tired, it's because one of his 6 children doesn't sleep very well at night. And I'm sure we can relate to that. A lot of us can relate to that. So I'm going to turn the time now to Benj to give us that take.

Thank you. It's, uh, it's good to be here. We'll try to make sales tax as exciting and fun and quick as possible here. But really the goal here on sales capture and leakage, and if— to understand what that is, the state looks at what each person typically spends in a year on all the possible sales tax categories. So what an average citizen of the state would spend on automobile dealerships, grocery stores, food and beverage, laundry services, museums. And then based on the median income that's associated with Orem and your population, It allows you to know what is the overall essentially purchasing power of Orem and what your residents should be spending on each of those different categories. Then state sales tax sends us the numbers of what your specific retailers are doing every year, and they put them into those very specific categories. And we look at the total sales tax they've generated and then compare it to what your residents should be. typically spending based on these statewide averages. If you have greater than 100%, that suggests that you are capturing more than what your city is essentially suggested to do. So you'd be gathering sales tax dollars from Provo or from neighboring cities. If you are leaking, so sales tax leakage, that's suggesting that maybe you don't have enough of those establishments or your residents are going to another city in order to use that type of store or entertainment. So just a quick thing here first, looking at some of your economic districts. It's just the overall map. We'll cruise through this to get to really the fun juicy stuff. This is the 2018 leakage. So as you can see on the top, essentially the top 2/3, you are positive in every— in all of those categories. Your capture rate— so what we're saying here on general merchandise stores, these would be like your Walmarts, Sometimes some of Walgreens' parts fit in there. You are capturing 173% of what your city's residents would be anticipated to capture. So you are capturing then dollars from other cities. Doing the same thing in furniture and home stores, grocery. Most communities do fairly well in grocery stores. A lot of people typically buy their groceries close to where they live. Electronics doing great. And the only areas, and the numbers are not overly significant, are in museums, historical sites, personal and laundry services. And there is some room here, gasoline stations and accommodation. You're essentially losing out there on maybe about $57 million in sales tax dollars to accommodation and gasoline stations. So based on—

question for you. You have there performing arts, spectator sports-related industries showing us way down. And yet we have a lot of people that come to the Hale, to the Sierra, you know, to a lot of events, sporting events. So I'm just—

They don't capture that. Is that because the—

They're nonprofit. They don't capture that at all.

I'm just curious, who are we getting compared to?

That's a good question on this, where some of those get captured. A lot of those have been You'd be— if you were losing money here, and again, it's, it's not a significant amount if you were to put that per your— No, I'm just using percentage. It would be things like professional or the minor league sports teams. It would be ski resorts, Vivint, SmartHome Arena.

Yes.

Real Stadium.

So comparing us more to Salt Lake than our surrounding communities.

Sure.

All of Chicago.

This is for all of Utah. This is all of Utah, yes.

Yeah, and that's not counting Sarah or Hale because it's nonprofit, they're not paying sales tax. So I mean, that's probably a skewed number.

Is it just Utah, or if somebody goes to Disneyland, does that fall into this?

Just Utah. These are just Utah sales tax.

Except Disneyland is part of Utah.

It's an extension. So anyways, looking at this from a city perspective, it may give just Just a little bit of thought that in future development, is there potential for additional gasoline stations, accommodations? That the initial market analysis or the sales leakage would suggest there may be an ability to capture some of that. Here's how you do comparing from other cities and how they did from 2013 to 2018. So just this 5-year leakage. As you can see, American Fork, primarily the Meadows, and American Fork has the benefit of great freeway access. They capture quite well. Lehi has improved a lot. Lindon, that's significant improvement there. Lindon captures a lot because of really about $160 million from Home Depot that they've been siphoning off of Pleasant Grove. Provo has its struggles.

So interestingly enough, Provo's population is 25% higher than Orem's, and they're dropping. So that's pretty significant.

Does everyone clap?

No, I don't mean it in a bad way, but just, you know, I think that shows something. And of course, Orem picks up a lot from Provo.

Absolutely.

picks up a lot from Vineyard, and Lyndon is starting to get more retail.

You can see the difference in Spanish Fork, and, you know, Walmart was added in Spanish Fork.

Does this also include, for example, home construction, home goods? So, for example, I know in Lyndon there are a lot of truss companies and insulation companies and drywall companies. So if the residential Economy is booming, then that's going to show up here too.

Yeah, sure. Anybody that pays sales tax ultimately ends up getting grouped into one of the different NICS codes.

So when you say home, this is not just Home Depot, this is Sunroc, this is—

Sure. I specifically— I was interested in Lyndon, so I looked up Lyndon's specific statistics and just saw that the Home Depot generated about $160 million in sales tax last year.

Just to Are there any of these communities where their, like, their gross sales tax revenue has decreased? In other words, their leakage rate, some of them have gone up or down, but is there any, even for like Pleasant Grove, for example, where they've gone from 99% to 45%, is their sales tax today still higher than it was?

That's a great question because I believe that all of them have had increases in their overall gross sales tax revenue.

Sales.

It's just that the declining— or increasing population, those sales haven't kept up with that population. It may be— I'll have to look again at Pleasant Grove— that Pleasant Grove has lost a little bit. But I believe we have those statistics here for you. There we go. Maybe I'm wrong here. Yeah, you can see Pleasant Grove, yes, is leaking significantly more. Now this is not gross sales. But you can see the difference in what they're capturing. So anything positive here would be above that 100% level. As you can see, Lehigh, if you remember in 2013, I think they were capturing 60% on the previous slide, and now they're closer in the 90%, really only leaking about $27 million.

But Provo and Pleasant Grove really stand out.

Yeah, significant, significant leakage there.

But I think also, if I may, what is kind of a growing concern to OREM is that trend north and that emerging growth that's happening that direction that to some degree is impacting us, certainly. And a little bit south, you got Spanish Fork. Yeah, correct.

Here you can see a lot of numbers here, but the light blue categories are where OREM And the cities are just in alphabetical order here. This is your— this is capture. So the cities in— or the light blue here is where you are, or the city is the leader in those categories. So you can see American Fork has greater sales capture, you know, than the other cities. And for motor vehicle purposes, you can see again there's Linden. That's interesting that that's what they're capturing. So that's not their total sales. But you can see, you know, Orem does quite well in a lot of categories there compared to some of these surrounding cities.

So Kathy, could we get a copy of these slides from you too?

Yes, absolutely. You also have a copy of this.

I was just thinking electronically or published.

Oh sure, I'd be happy to.

And it's interesting, even for Provo, if you go to like the art Arts, entertainment, and recreation. It's interesting that they're even leaking so much on that when they've got BYU and the stadium and all that kind of stuff. So every single city is leaking in that front.

Yep. And here's interesting too, and I don't know that I have the great answer here for you, sales tax is unable to answer, but gasoline stations are leaking in every city, which you would not expect. But maybe, you know, a lot of people, if If they work in Salt Lake County, they fill up on their way home from work. They spend their dollars there. Typically you would see that, well, hey, American Ford just has the better located gas stations and that's where people are filling up. But so that's a little interesting. The overall numbers that they're leaking are not significant. And then just a few things overall on the overall retail market and market trends. We do a lot of market trend analysis for different cities. You know, if you're ever interested, we'd love to just share with you more data. What is doing well in Utah? So grocery stores are doing very, very well. Formats for grocery stores are changing significantly though. Larger store sizes are going away a little bit to a little bit smaller of a footprint, or keeping the same footprint and more of that is going towards Storage, and for online, you know, the pickups, the essentially more of a warehousing type operation. It's cheaper for the grocery store, it's more profitable for them. Small eateries and restaurants are doing very well. 2017-2018 was the highest number of store closings in the nation and in Utah, but it's also the highest number of store openings. It's just that we have the highest number of store closings where large things like JCPenney's and Macy's and Kohl's stores and large 40,000-square-foot floor plates.

And we're opening up a lot of 4,000- and 5,000-square-foot sushi and burger places.

Concept stores do really well. People really want to have an experience. They want to come try out the blender before they buy it. They want to try the exercise clothes. They want to experience something different that you're not you're not getting to other places. What is struggling? Department stores are struggling, jewelry stores, really anything that has to have— that you feel like you can do a little better online. Overbuilt retail is a very common topic right now. Developers, for the most part, feel that we are very overbuilt with retail and that overall along the Wasatch Front, we're about 25 square feet per capita. per capita of retail space. And developers feel that we should be in the range of 15 to 20 square feet of retail space. So if you just take a midpoint of that, 17.5, and from where we're at, at 25 square feet, that's 7.5 square feet per every resident. So if you have 100,000 people in Orem, that would essentially suggest that you have about 750,000 square feet of excess retail, right, as we are moving more and more Online shopping. Online shopping. Shopping needs are changing. So it would just be a consideration in moving forward that you already have a supply of retail that is— that has been vacant, that is vacant for an extended period, that won't be repurposed, that is, you know, part of that. It doesn't mean that you're going to lose sales tax dollars because we're shrinking floor plates or we're shrinking the amount of size that people need. It just means that your retail centers need to be very well purposed. And that your key nodes need to be consistently refreshed and need to be— you need to take advantage of those key nodes because we're reducing the amount of square feet we have per resident. The spots where people are going to be shopping should see increased sales per square foot on a sales per square foot metric. And then really understanding the fiscal impacts per square feet of your specific retailers. Particularly if you are providing increment dollars through tax increment financing, you can leverage that by requiring specific type of retailers. Now you can't say, hey, we only want a Five Guys Burger, but you can say, we'll provide increment here if that tenant is generating $400 a square foot in sales per year. And you can be very specific, and cities are doing this.

I was just going to say, do you see cities doing this?

Yes, so cities are doing this now because they're tired of the top Taco Times, nothing wrong with anyone who owns Taco Times. They're tired of some of those stores and they want to see some higher-producing stores. And here, just as an example, here are what a couple of different retailers generate on a per-square-foot basis. So Costco, you know, about $5.25 per square foot, which is pretty remarkable considering their stores are about 140,000 square feet. So this is direct sales tax You know, back, you know, that you would see as a city.

Per foot, per what?

Per square foot per year.

Per year, yep, it's a year.

Okay, gotcha. So Walgreens is understandable because it's pharmaceuticals and those are expensive.

A lot of that's not taxed, right?

Interesting here, look at the difference in Shopko and Costco. We point this out a lot. Shopko, obviously going out of business or bankrupt now in most ways. They are, they take up almost the same floor plate as as a Costco, right? Average Shopko store is about 96,000 square feet. Costco is close to 140,000. But you saw these big parking lots. And look what you're getting as a city. You end up getting about $60,000 in direct sales tax off a Shopko. You get about $750,000.

That's an optimistic number.

What's that? That's an optimistic number. I took a couple from Salt Lake County. Costco, some Costcos are— I don't know what you're seeing, but we see $650,000 in a couple cities are generating direct off of Costco. But just knowing—

Where's Target? You don't see it in there, but they're a significant part of our—

Yeah, Target does pretty well. I mean, they would certainly be well below Costco and above Shopko. I'll have to look what the Target number is. But Target does pretty well.

That's got to be per month or something, isn't it?

$5?

It is. It's just the sales tax, generally.

Oh, the sales tax.

Thank you. Thank you.

And that's—

any questions?

I think if I may too, anecdotally, some of what is being discussed is exactly what we've seen at University Place. If you recall, when that whole plan emerged, there was discussion about taking down retail, and the concern was—

Why would you do that?

Yeah, why would you do that? We're going to lose tax revenue. Their representation was, no, we're going to make more efficient use of the property and the floor plates that we have.

Sure.

And that's exactly what's happened, where they've kind of surpassed that holy grail of retail, which is $400 a square foot. They've exceeded that. It's kind of counterintuitive, but the reality is too, we've had a number of developers along key corridors of the city who have said, we are interested in redeveloping, but we're not interested in redeveloping exactly as currently constituted. We need some additional uses, some variety. We're not looking to, to just locate a 60,000-square-foot box. It needs to be something different.

Mayor and Jamie, to that point, across from Macy's grocery store was a place that had been zoned retail forever and the people had held on to it for a long, long time. We finally allowed some high-density family units to be put in there and some were frustrated because they said, no, we need more retail.

And it's Benj—

Benjamin, yeah.

Community. Benjamin.

His argument was, no, we've got roughly 25% too much or whatever.

You know, it's interesting, the city of Orem In the last 6 years, our sales tax has gone up, our revenue's gone up by 30%, which is really astounding. I had one gentleman who was running for council position 2 years ago said, why in the world would you ever do anything with the mall because retail's dying? And I said, well, you have to understand that they put in a mixed-use facility and it's a different kind of retail. But it's also interesting if you look at Eagle Mountain, they're having a very strenuous and hard discussion with the public because they have no retail sales.

That's true.

They have no sales tax revenue, but their city continues to grow and services are being stretched and they don't have the money for them. And they're trying to say, look, we've got to bring retail sales, we've got to bring businesses in. and the citizens don't want them, and it's a real struggle. So I mean, we're really lucky to have a strong retail center, even to the point that the mayor of Provo says she does all of her shopping in Orem. So don't put that anywhere, but—

I think, Mayor, to your point—

I think we just did.

To Mr. Davidson, your point about—

to UTA about this relative How much jobs do you have in Orem?

These numbers bear that out. That, as you're saying, Eagle Mountain might have the growing population and the desire for more bus routes, but if you look at their sales tax dollars, if you look at those statistics on sales tax generation, Orem obviously holds a very enviable position in the county and a very longstanding position of providing significant sales tax revenue to the transit agency that should be, you know, at some point, Very heavily weighed against the other cities in their ability to make decisions.

In fact, one of the reports that we've been working on, Council, has been related to our transient room and restaurant tax. And we also are very strong contributors to that system, and we're starting to ask the question, are we getting our fair share of that money in return from the county? And Brynn's been working on that, and we'll bring that to you. The answer is no, but, you know, I think these conversations are ones that we constantly need to have because developing more efficient retail uses is what is going to allow us to remain successful as a retail destination.

I think on that note, if I have 1 grocery store next to my house versus 5 grocery stores, I'm not going to spend 5 times as much on groceries.

with that location.

And so I think with, you know, University Place and other developers that are looking at more of those mixed-use type facilities, you don't even necessarily need to increase your retail footprint, but you have more foot traffic in those areas in that same amount of space. So I think that's really—

So you're trying to develop unique retail outlets that are unique to this area, to the county. You know, car dealerships right now are an example. an Apple Store, some of these other types of uses where if there are, you know, an interest on a regional level, they're going to look here.

We want to do what we can to attract them here regionally.

Well, and to that point, we have done that. So Trader Joe's looked and they came here. NPS looked, they came here. You know—

Taco time.

Taco time, well— but Taconos looked, they came here. And it's interesting that regional stores— Al's was going to expand up north, and they decided to come here.

Can I ask—

the last slide that showed the— just a wild guess what the Apple Store— you mentioned the Apple Store— what they do per square foot?

Oh, it's high.

$27 a square foot. So the only things that I could find, the only stores I could find that were fairly similar to that were Lululemon, and they're very small stores. It's incredibly expensive spandex. And then Tiffany's jewelries, Tiffany's Jewelers, so they also do up in the $20 to $30 range. So anyways, just interesting.

Can I make a comment? Debbie, you still had a question.

Okay, so I appreciate Brian and Kathy, because I actually requested this report. This report is gold for economic development. This was the most important document when I was in AmeriCorps that I would get. This shows you where your strengths are, where your weaknesses are. I cannot commend this report to you enough. It also shows over time where we may lose as other areas, you know, deal with— provide more of their own citizenry and they want to capture their own people. So please, this to me is the holy Bible of economic development. I cannot stress to you that enough. And some of that American for Growth, I'm going to take credit for because I've worked for 8 years filling gaps, working with retailers to try to fill the gaps in American Fork. So I commend this to your reading. I commend this to understanding this. Also cautionary though, I mean, we're doing great, but as other cities capture more of their citizenry percentage, we could lose. So we—

it's—

I just say it's—

we're doing great.

Thank you. I expect us to continue to do great, but just know that it's like she said, American Fork and some of these other ones capture the people. They're not going to be traveling to Orem. They're going to be staying closer. So we need to make sure we're always, always looking for the right mixture for our, our community, capturing our dollars.

Yep.

And the one thing, the new hotel at the mall, that shows that should do very, very well. That, that hotel, I have no, no no concern about that doing well. So thank you for, for putting together this for me. This was my request, so thank you.

Kathy, we need an Apple Store.

We have a request to ask.

Are you sure you're with Zions? Because there's a way we can tell when Zions people are here normally. Chocolate.

I know.

Grinch mix.

I was in the car for a long time today and It melts a lot in the car.

Okay, thank you. We'll give you a pass.

Next time.

You can mail it.

Well, thank you, Benj, and thank you, Kathy. All right, we'll move on to gang loitering and, uh, turn the time over to Chief Giles.

Well, I'll catch us back up because I think this could be pretty quick unless you have a lot of questions. Okay, so, uh, I think all of you have been here when we've done the gang, uh, loitering updates before, so I don't need to get too far into it. Utah Code 76-9902— I'm sorry, actually 76-9905 gives municipality legislative bodies the ability to designate certain areas as gang loitering areas. Back in 2009, the city council designated, or actually passed a resolution which designated all of our parks and public schools as being subject to the state gang loitering laws. That has been in effect since 2009. The one caveat was that we have to do a periodic review, and that is this. And so once a year I come in here to tell you that I think it actually is still working. We are doing very well. I think our gang activity continues, but not nearly at the level that we would see in like Salt Lake County. In fact, some of you may have seen some Metro gang unit officers down here during the Summerfest. That was more of their request. We actually, as part of our task force here in Utah County, Major Crimes Task Force, we actually donate 2 guys, which are actually a Lehi officer and an American Fork officer, I believe, to what's called the Safe Street Project, which is a gang— federally funded gang project. So they work with the gang units up there. As part of that, they offered to come down and work some of the carnivals down here during our Well, during Summerfest, during Strawberry Days, so forth. So we did have a few come down. In fact, I think on Friday night we saw 12 of them come down, which was a little bit overblown, a little bit more than we really needed. But at the same time, they did actually encounter— in fact, I was joking with them the next night on Saturday night as to, well, did you get bored down here in Orem? They said, no, we actually did find a few gang members and we had some interaction. We actually had to kick some people out of the park for some gang activity that was going on. So we do have that here. It is in our city. We've been fortunate, knock on wood, we've been fortunate not to have a whole lot of it. We did have so far this year, as some of you probably know, we did have a homicide in March— actually, I'm sorry, in February— and another shooting which was not gang-related, but the first one may have been gang-related in nature, the one where it was actually a homicide. The other shooting, the victim did survive. But again, we don't have nearly the visibility that some cities do. For example, if you go to West Valley, and I don't mean to throw them under the bus, but that's kind of the epicenter, I think, of a lot of gang activity here in the state. You go to West Valley and you do see a lot more activity out in the open. than you would here, especially in Orem.

So I remember 5 years ago having the discussion that gang activity was picking up in Orem.

It was a concern.

We tried to do some proactive things, and it seems like what we've done has worked, and it seems like the prevalence of gangs has lessened. I don't know if that's— or maybe it's just not increasing. But how are your views on that?

And my view on that is that I think you're right. I think 2 things. I don't think it's increasing, which is a win, because as our population increases and the gang activity does not, I mean, obviously we're doing something to keep it at bay. We've had an increase over the last 2 or 3 months of graffiti, and I apologize, I was going to get some numbers for you, and I was up to actually at a meeting at the state capitol and just came straight back and printed some things off to give you.

here.

So I don't have the exact numbers, but over the last 3 months we've actually had an increase in some graffiti, some of that being gang graffiti. I wouldn't say that all graffiti— if you go down the road and you see graffiti, I wouldn't say that all of it is gang graffiti. A lot of it are just teenagers that are bored, to be honest with you. Some of it is gang graffiti. We did have a juvenile, and actually juvenile female, who was— who had been recruiting for a gang in some of the junior highs. We did find out about that. She had been spray painting some gang monikers and some gang graffiti, especially on some LDS churches in the area about 2 months ago, maybe a month and a half ago. So we have had an increase and a little bit of an uptick, but we do— what we have been doing is with our SROs, our school resource officers, they've been very good at keeping close ties in with a lot of the kids. We've been able to solve those very quickly. Most of the time. The other thing that we do is that when we take care of the minor things, for example, the Neighborhood Preservation Unit, I know that it doesn't sound like a very big deal when we're dealing with— and I know to you guys it does, but to the public, sometimes they wonder why we're dealing with the junky yards and those minor crimes. Well, guess what? That's where— it's kind of like pest control, if you will.

Right.

If we deal with those minor issues, The pests go away, in a sense. That's where issues start. When we overlook those minor crimes, those minor issues, people look at that, the gang members look at that, and they say, look, this is an area where we can thrive. This is an area where they don't care. When we deal with those issues right away, I think it tells them that we do care and that we are going to deal with it. And if it gets to be a bigger problem, we are going to deal with that as well.

Thank you.

And so I think here in Orem we've dealt with it very well. We did have some major gang problems back in the late '90s, early 2000s. We had a lot of gang members that were coming in all of Utah County, not just Orem. That was at a time when I was actually in the task force myself and worked some undercover. At that time we did have a major gang problem coming into Utah County. Right now, again, it's not gone. It is still there. I think a lot of it is kind of a little bit hidden to the public in a way. I think the officers, we do see it and we know it's there, but we do attack it really quickly and aggressively. And the nuisance ordinances, where we can actually look at them, find that they are a nuisance, and deal with some of the minor issues, I think we can get them out before it evolves into a bigger issue.

All right.

Which are some of the gangs that we're seeing activity from?

Do you have MS-13 here?

We do have MS-13. You're always going to see a lot of, a lot of the Mexican gangs. The MS-13, we do have some. A lot of them are more up in the Salt Lake area. We do have some Tongan Crip gangs that are in the area. That's what the juvenile that I told you about, about a month and a half ago, she was recruiting for a Tongan Crip gang. So a lot of the traditional gangs— well, we've had a few— a lot of them tend to be within a minority group. We have had some Asian gangs in the area, but sometimes they have to do with even just where they live. It doesn't even necessarily have to do with their race or anything else. We actually had one— Kind of ironic. A trailer court here in town, which was the Village Green trailer court at 222 North 1200 West. For a short time, we had a little gang that popped up in there, and they were spray painting all over town, but they were called— they called themselves the Village Green Mafia or the VG Mafia. And so we've had actually some different little areas like that. And believe it or not, you know, I know we can laugh and think— I laugh at it. I think, oh, that's kind of funny. We actually— that was— that actually turned into some turf wars and some violence. We actually did have some of them that had guns and had some violent fights over that. And they all involve— gangs inherently involve violence, drugs, and other crimes. And so that's why we want to get rid of them. We don't want the gang activity here in our city. And I think so far we've done pretty good. Again, with an increase in population, with an increase in Even just coming into the school, for example, at UVU. People don't grow out of it when they turn 18. So as we get people that are coming to school, commuting in, we are actually seeing a lot of people that are moving into our area that may have been in a gang somewhere else. A lot of parents will come from— I'm sorry, from California where their kids were involved in gangs and they think that if they can move to Utah, and get them out of the gangs and get them away from them, that everything will be good. But what happens a lot of times is they come to Utah and now they're the big-time gangster from California. And so all of a sudden, all these little younger kids start flocking to them as the leader. And so we'll see them start their own little gang here. So that can happen. But I do think that things are going pretty good at this point. Again, I'm not saying that we don't have them. We do have gangs in our city. But I think that we are keeping it at least at bay for right now. We're keeping it at a level that's not increasing. Great.

Well, thank you very much.

Thank you.

Appreciate it.

Okay, we'll now go on to an annual sewer report from Neil Winterton and Chris Schurke.

It's only natural that we talk about this.

I mean, it's the Leakage and other—

it's a different context. So this presentation, I've taken 25 pages of the report, condensed it down to 5, 2 of which are a beginning and an end. So, you're welcome.

Thank you.

It is a report that is required to be presented to the City Council. And so we have to check the box that says, did you present this to the City Council? And the first section— there are 3 sections— is the financial evaluation. And it's much longer than this. This is actually just the first This is the first snippet of the report where we report to the state of Utah some things about our system, and I just wanted to highlight $312 is our annual sewer charge to the residents of Orem. It's a pretty good deal. That's about 7,000 gallons per month. Some of the questions they ask, are property taxes allocated to help run the system? And that's a no. We are a fee-based enterprise fund, and all the other things are yes, which says, do you have sufficient funds now? Do you have sufficient funds in the future? And thanks to the support of the City Council and our master plan, we answer yes to those questions. The next section is titled the Collection System Evaluation. And some of the benchmarks there are Class 1 and Class 2 sanitary sewer overflows. Class 1 SSOs, as we call them, are pretty intense backups that would bubble out, maybe enter the waters of the state, and cause significant damage. Class 2s is when there's a backup in the system, And they might bubble up into a basement. And unfortunately this year we had 2. For a system of our size, that's actually a good number. While we work to prevent any and all, we had 2 that resulted from some backups that resulted from some high flows that came, which We are already in the process and have a design ready to take care of that, Mayor.

So, Neil, I know in the past we've had the problems with the Phantom Dumper. We've had the problems with the burn-off or whatever, the smell affecting the neighborhood. I haven't heard anything from the neighborhood. I haven't seen the Phantom Dumper. How are things?

We've slowed down on any issues with the Phantom Dumper. The Phantom Dumper, our campaign of information has been effective. Occasionally we get items that are not necessarily that issue, but other issues that we deal with on, you know, a regular basis. Not as frequent and as exact as what we were experiencing with the Phantom Dumper, but we have issues there.

I think Steve Downs actually was behind it.

That was it.

Just for listening.

He's got great memory.

It grew. Yeah.

So I'll get to your second question too.

We had a situation in our neighborhood where I think it was, um, I'm not sure if it was Questar or Dominion Gas or Energy at that point, but they, they were doing some road work to, um, you know, replace some lines, and one of the sewer lines to my neighbor got their line crushed. I didn't realize until a few weeks later. Took them a while to figure out what had happened, but so they had some, I guess, I'm not sure if it was a leak or a backup, but they had an issue in their home as a result. Would that be like one of these, or this is more like a system-wide, no, there's too much at one time?

Yeah, so the private lateral issues are not ours. That's a private lateral issue. People will have offsets and aging infrastructure and everything else that That caused those. This is a result of our mainline that caught some debris and then built up, and unfortunately it backed up. And those do occur.

We work vigorously to stop those.

So those 2 that did happen, I'm assuming if there was some sort of damage, we would be liable?

That's correct. Okay.

Yeah.

And were we—

and was there extensive damage?

Not extensive, no.

We go in there, we clean the carpets, a few thousand dollars in this instance. We had one before that was a water main break that caused much more damage than that a couple years ago, if you recall.

Most of the time we find these from people calling in saying, hey, I've got it coming up my drain. Almost 90% of the time it's their own lateral, it's the problem, but we dispatch a truck out there immediately. We take calls. If you have a sewer lateral backup or someone you know does, have them call us. We will come right out, verify all of our lines, we'll look at it, and then we'll—

Neil, is one of those Class 2 issues the issue along Warren Boulevard?

Both of them.

Okay.

So for example, in this particular case, Staff looked at the problems and from an engineering perspective, design— they're in the process of designing solutions to address these issues. So these are not necessarily one-off type issues. These are issues that could happen again unless we make modifications to our system, and that's what Neil and his team and Giles and others are engaged in. Yeah, I see several employees For those of you in the audience that are kind of laughing, not aware of what the Phantom Dumper is, a number of years ago we had an individual or individuals that were illegally discharging into our sewer system.

So we affectionately labeled the individuals the Phantom Dumper on a routine basis because those—

Get shirts and mugs and—

Yeah, that was not our section's idea. That came from a different department.

That was a Stephen Downs creation. Never got into water bottles.

No, never got on—

but we did sell some t-shirts.

Mayor, to answer your question about some odors, so we've entered into a pretty deep and extensive odor study, if you will, and we're still in the middle of that. The thing we did find was a small belly in our methane gas flare. So we send extra gas over to the flare to burn it off. Well, when there's a belly in it, it backed up and occasionally that burns. And we have since repaired that. We haven't had a— we will get an odor complaint here and there. I mean, we have—

That was pretty regular, almost. Every couple of weeks, and now we haven't had it.

So yeah, that, that took care of that. We do get odors from Utah Lake that come and we get blamed for as well, but fortunately we found that issue, and we are diving into other characteristics of our digester gas to make it more clean and, and more reliable to burn.

Good.

Yeah, so the collection system, the mechanical plant is the third section, and just to highlight where we are, we are in 2018, since we're reviewing that, 8.5 million gallons per day is what we send on average to the facility. Our facility Our facility capacity is 13.5 million gallons a day. When we hit a magic number of 80% of that 13.5 million gallons, which is 10.8, we have to start considering and start the process of an upgrade and moving along. By 85%, that's another step forward in that process. So far, our numbers are increasing Slightly, but with conservation efforts and improvements to our system, meaning lining our system and tightening it up against infiltration, we're holding that number fairly steady.

That's great.

Our population is increasing and that number is staying steady. Our water numbers, just for your information, are going down in per capita use, which is a good sign as well. All of our trends are trending in the right and good direction. Neil, can you also mention or address that in 2000 or so, our average daily flow was around 10 million gallons a day, and it's gone down all the way down to about 7.5, and now it's coming back up again to 8.5.

And maybe you can speak to that, we talked about that today.

So we attribute that to more efficient fixtures in the home, conservation messages, and tightening up our system with construction projects and keeping the leakage out.

Not all reduction is good. As you drive around the city and see people just not caring for their lawns, so there is a trade-off. in this reduction from higher prices that it led to some less caring for their lawns. So I don't want us to pat ourselves on the back too much when we said we reduced, we reduced, and reduced, when some lawns need to increase, increase, increase. And maybe we priced them out of the business.

Well, again, that was 20 years ago when our rates were exceptionally low, so—

That's what I'm saying.

They're higher now, and then we priced them out.

Right, but this, uh, the sewer, these, these numbers came back to 8 million gallons many years ago.

So it was prior to the increases in the water rates.

Yes, but for example, as we improve the condition of our system, we minimize infiltration, so we don't essentially accept water that's not meant to be in the sewer system.

We also need to treat Groundwater and other water sources. So the conservation that's recognized within the sewer section is not the—

That reduction's good.

Yeah. Yeah, gotcha.

But fair point otherwise. Kind of the overall benchmark of the water reclamation facility For, for just what is our end goal is right here, notice of violations, violating the permit. That, that is what we don't want to happen. We have a permit issued through the state of Utah and EPA guidelines that has parameters for what we can discharge into Powell Slough, which eventually goes to Utah Lake. And that is our ultimate Measuring stick and word zero. And Giles Demke is our Water Reclamation Section Manager, and he and his staff work diligently and are dedicated to that task. There is a section in the financial component that says, does your city offer training to your employees and how much is it covered?

100%, 75%?

We answer 100%.

100%. 100% on that. And I just extend the appreciation of the employees that we have a— it's not robust and we have to consider who and where we're going, but we send our employees to training every year. And that is appreciated to stay up to speed on all the regulatory and execution and safety of the equipment.

Thank you.

So I know it's been a big question for the last few years, and that's what our effluent is doing to Utah Lake. And we have the 2% standard that the state has put out there, and we're well within the limits, but I know that they're trying to tighten it up. Can you give us any update on what—

Yeah, yeah, that's a, that's a good question. The state has issued Yes. They include a 1 milligram per liter discharge requirement by 2020 for all facilities without a waiver. We can meet that permit with the addition of chemical and binding that phosphorus in our biosolids, which then we send to the farmers, which they want. The study that's taking place is going to be a long-term study for long-term implementation for Utah Lake limits. And that study probably— when it started, they said, oh, it'll probably take about 3 years.

It's the nutrients they don't want.

That's correct.

Phosphorus being one of them.

Yeah.

So there's a pretty hotly debated issue as to whether or not the nutrients are coming from the facilities or whether they occur in nature or stormwater runoff or whether there's so much in the sediment or how much comes from the rain. I'm a member of the steering committee for the Utah Lakes Study. And we have about quarterly meetings to discuss and there's a study Yes. They have the science panel assembled and they're issuing RFPs for studies and I think the answers will have— will come in about 3 years, maybe 4 years, which will then result in a final determination which will probably be debated at that time as well among scientists for what the end result and what the limit will be.

In the meantime, Thank you.

I think the Orem has been a good example and been ahead of this curve due to the foresight we had back in 2000, 2008 when we started the design for the most recent upgrade. And with our reuse project, we are actually thinking ahead, and not only are we planning to meet effluent standards for reuse, but with that project project include some filtration that will help us with those nutrient limits when undoubtedly they will probably become even more stringent than now.

Okay, thank you. Any questions? All right, appreciate it.

Thanks, Chris.

We'll now go on to a fitness center project update. Jamie Davidson is our presenter with Memphis What can you do on Big D Construction?

Thank you, Mayor. We, um, we do actually have representatives of Big D and Method, and they're going to come into the room and share with you kind of progress as to where we are relative to our fitness center. And, uh, we believe we have landed on a, um, an internal concept that meets the needs of Our patrons, consistent with feedback we've been receiving for the last number of years relative to what they want to see in the fitness center. At the same time, we have had conversations with the Alpine School District about realigning the, the essentially front face of the center so that the face of the center would front Center Street. And we are able to address some parking issues we have in and around the school and the fitness center. We are also in the process of obviously working very diligently with Big D and Method in trying to manage the costs associated with construction of this facility. One of the other things that we represented as part of this process, as part of the bond process a number of months ago now, was that we would share our proposed plans with the public in some sort of public open house. And we have in fact scheduled that open house for Thursday, June 27th at the Orem Fitness Center from 5 to 7 PM. And we've already communicated that message via social media, and you'll see us through other means throughout the week communicating that invitation to our customer patron base and the residents to come and take a look at the direction that we are heading. This will not be a public hearing, but rather a public open house and a public meeting where individuals will be invited to come and see conceptually what we have designed to this point. And at that point as well, they'll also be given An idea as to, well, how did we get to this point? Why are some of the things in the facility— why are they there? Why are they— and really the short answer is it's based on the feedback we've received from our customers and our patrons as to what they wanted to see. There'll be some additional conversations about the financing and how we are going to get there in terms of funding the facility. Additionally, there'll be a conversation And some information available about, as we proceed forward with the construction process, what are some of the key dates associated with the center. For example, we anticipate that we are going to shut down the dry section of the facility in July in anticipation for demolition. But we also have amenities and opportunities for our patrons to continue to keep up with their workouts and things like that at the, at the Senior Center. We'll offer some classes at the Senior Center as well. We also have an opportunity to use the track that's available downstairs in the Senior Center. I know there's been some concern about high school swim teams and, and our co-sponsored swimming relationship with Orem-Timpanogos swim, and we've worked those issues out as well. So we want an opportunity to tell our patron base, you're welcome to come and continue to use facilities off-site, or you're welcome to, for example, enter into some additional arrangement with the city where we would actually push your membership to, you know, extend the life of your membership into the new facility when it opens. And then finally, we'll unveil what we have as our proposed fitness center. Now, we kind of feel like it's important to have this conversation in advance of setting Method Studio loose to start designing all the very specific architectural drawings associated with construction of the facility. Some of the things we're going to show you tonight might have been very specifically redesigned and massaged based on an effort to try and manage costs. And I think I talked with you a few weeks ago about, look, we're trying to minimize the number of corridors we have in the facility, because if we minimize the number of corridors, then we can reduce the square footage, still accommodate all the amenities that we want to have in the facility. If we're talking about, for example, $300 a square foot to build this facility. We cut 10,000 square feet out of the facility. We saved $3 million. So those are some of the things we've been doing as well. At the same time, we're excited to show you some exterior elevations, give you several alternatives for you to choose from as to what you think might be the most attractive and have the highest curb appeal for the fitness center and for our patrons. moving forward. So we have Joe Smith and Scott Smith who are with us here tonight from Method Studio to share with you the progress that we've been making. And that progress and that conversation has included Method, Big D Construction, recreation staff, our engineering staff, the Alpine School District, our finance risk management— who am I forgetting, Brent?

IT.

IT, our chief building officials, all of them have been party to these discussions.

So—

Sam, hold on one second.

So are you looking for a recommendation today on the elevations, or can that wait till after we have the open house and getting public input?

Well, our desire is to come to the open house with a relatively good idea as to the direction that we're heading. Now, the very detailed specifics of it, not necessarily. I don't think Joe is it. But obviously, we're getting to the point where when we start demoing a building, we've got to kind of accelerate the process too. So we don't have a ton of time, but we have some time to have a conversation about, okay, materials, what obviously we want the exterior to look like. Do we want it more kind of glass-based or brick-based or whatever? Lissy, I'm sorry.

I was going to say, I think another big thing for us tonight is we're going to be printing big foam boards for that event. Any direction on which elevation should we use for the conceptual pictures for the foam boards for the event?

And we do have some, I think, some 3D representations we can share with you too. So it's not just you So you can get a 2-dimensional perspective, and hopefully you can see within the facility what it might look like.

And I'm not trying to minimize all of the public input that got us to this point, certainly, but I'm just trying to understand by the end of this meeting how set in stone is this stuff going to be, or is it just kind of this is Plan A going forward?

We see this in large part as the Plan A. That we would like to protect.

Okay, got it.

E-Plan, and then we have 2 pretty different rendering aesthetics to the building that we're going to show you. If we could narrow it down to one, like Jamie said, if in the end we have to change some of the detailing of that, I think that's okay. But to stay on schedule, we'd like to see if it's possible to narrow it down to one of the rendering options.

And we'll see.

Okay.

Okay? Sure did. So Jamie, thank you. Great information and introduction to the whole process. From our part, we've been very appreciative of the collaborative and team effort that we've seen coming from the city. They're highly, highly invested in Bringing this project to a successful, you know, moving along and moving forward successfully. So everyone's working really hard, we're all working really fast. Big D has been a great partner and I appreciate their efforts as well. So we're going to actually kick things off by talking just to give you a quick overview of the schedule.

Any way to make that bigger or not really?

I can zoom in. Yeah, why don't you zoom in at least part of the computer?

And we do have representatives from Big D here too. They were behind me and I didn't— I failed to recognize them, but it's good to have them with us. So if you have questions for them—

A little bigger.

Sorry, that's good right there.

So there might be a little more detail in here than we need to get into, um, but, uh, we want to hit on some of the key points. So we're gonna, we're gonna deliver this project in bid packages. It's the only way to meet the schedule. I'm working with Big D to determine what those bid packages are. So it's going to— we're going to kick things off with the demolition package, and then there's going to be a footings and foundation at site package, and then there will be a structural package, and then the finishes will be the final package. So that enables the contractor to get in the ground sooner, and, you know, the design team has to make Move along at a very fast clip in order to meet that demand and that schedule. And so we're all working hard to make the decisions and to investigate what needs to happen and then present those options to you. So looking at the schedule here, so that bid package 1, which is demolition—

So could I ask a question real quick?

Yes.

So having built my own home, And having worked as a laborer during college and whatnot, I've noticed that sometimes people will build a home, they think they've got everything right, and they realize that their stairway going up should have been a foot wider.

Yeah.

And what I noticed was sometimes it's good to get a second set of eyeballs to see if there's something somebody missed. So I don't know if you do that internally to Do you sit there and say, you know, have we got this main hallway the right width? Or, you know, got the lighting right?

So, great question. So we do have what we call an internal quality control or quality assurance process. So we have a quality control director. He's a seasoned architect, 30-year architect, and he has 2 other staff that work with him that are all 20, 30-year architects, and they review all the projects So they'll be reviewing the project at all the milestones. In addition to that, the fact that we have Big D in the CMGC role gives us the benefit to get the contractor's opinion on constructability and on some of these issues that you're talking about. So they're going to be reviewing the drawings as well. In addition to that, working very closely and collaboratively with the folks here at the city, They're reviewing the drawings along with us, so we're all looking at those dimensions and those things very carefully.

Yeah, I just hate to get to the end and say, man, we wish we made that bathroom entrance a different angle or something.

Right.

We actually too have visited other rec facilities and we've asked them specifically, if you could do things differently, what would you do? Well, we'd add this, we'd delete this, we'd expand this, we'd We still see that risk management also does great facility maintenance efforts.

So we're tracking a little higher than this.

Oh good.

Brings an extra perspective.

So Brent asked if we were tracking around 80,000 square feet. So we're higher than 80,000 square feet now, but we're not 90. So in recent investigations, we found a way to increase in square footage without increasing cost a whole lot. And I can explain that in plan when we get to plan on how we're able to do that. So we're currently tracking about 84,000 square feet. So, and that's still— there's a lot of detail to be figured out, so it's gonna, it's gonna flux 1,000 up or down from where we're at right now. But we've been able to get more program space than initially planned But we have less circulation or inefficient circulation space, so it's all been consolidated in a healthy, open type of environment that we think is working quite well. So I'd love to hear your thoughts and opinions. We'll get into the floor plan, and then we'll also— we have some interior renderings to show you kind of the beginnings of what the look and feel of how the space is laying out, and then some exterior renderings. Hopefully that begins to tell the story. Going back to the schedule, so we've got the demolition package. So demolition will begin really at the end of June is what we're talking about, and that's when they're going to be moving. There's a lot of equipment and things that have to move, so we're giving time to move out and then demolition will commence. The second bid package will happen at the end of the first week in August. That's when the footings and foundation package will be submitted to the city. They'll go through permit review and bidding at the same time. So we're overlapping those processes in order, again, to expedite schedule so that Big D can start construction, you know, immediately after demolition. Demolition process was about 6 weeks?

Yeah, yeah, about 6 weeks. We anticipate that to start around August 1st and run about 6 weeks. So we should be mid-September before we're, you know, starting to really work on foundation work.

So the month of July will be for move-out and getting all those— there's some elements that have been identified that need to be salvaged and moved out and preserved. So the city and the recreation folks are going to be working on Removing those things, getting it prepared and ready to start demolition.

Where are you going to store that stuff?

Anything that's going to be used will be at the senior center. Anything that is not, we have bought 2 shipping containers that are on site down at Public Works that will be stored.

So from there, we have bid package 2, which The structural footings and foundations, and then that showed more than it would be, as well as the site work and site utilities, so that they can start sort of building the structure after that demolition occurs.

So how long will the footing foundation portion last?

As far as the getting the drawings out, once we get the package out, then they'll begin construction.

I'm just curious how long the construction of the footing foundation will last. Are we going to be going into the winter, or are we going to be able to get it done prior to?

It's probably—

is that noted on here? I can pull it up separately. Oh, we've got it here.

So probably one long weekend, you said?

Very long weekend then.

So it looks like the middle of December.

Flip one more page.

Should say a foundation package.

It looked like it said December 9th. Yeah, right there.

Prep and place foundations. That says November 14th. What's the footing and what's all below it? Plate, slab on grade. So yeah, you're in the months of November and December. Okay.

Then you're back to here.

It looks like it's good weather.

It actually looks like it starts in October.

Our project manager Spencer, who put together the schedule, he couldn't join us today.

So, um, For bid package 2, we'll have bid package 3, which is the envelope of the core. We'll be delivering that around mid-November. So it's going to be overlapping while construction activities are occurring. We're still working on drawings on the next, the next piece, the next phase. Again, this is in an effort to try to minimize the closure of the pools and try to get the project built in a faster time period. Do you want to show the pool?

So the pool will—

right now what we're targeting is that we're going to expedite, or Big D will be expediting the work on the locker rooms specifically so that we can reopen the pools in April.

I think it's April that we targeted.

Yep. So that minimizes the amount of time that the pools will be closed. And we can open them back up in April, is the goal. So they'll be working on the finishes and the functionality of those while the rest of it, of the construction, will be trailing behind and will not necessarily be complete. But we'll have temporary walls that are secure and safe, and then an operating mechanical and electrical and plumbing for the— and then the Thank you.

This is probably more directed to city management.

What's the use of the SERA pool for rec center people during— starting July 1st?

Yes, starting July 1st, and actually starting right now, people have been given emails and stopped at front desk when they clock in to give an option of if they choose to keep their Operational Option 1, we call it. They get 2 times the amount of time left on their pass at the Senior Center, and they're given an option. If the family pass, they get 25 open plunge pass, punch pass. If it's an individual senior or student, they get a 10-punch pass to the CRF open plunge. Or if they're a lap swimmer, they can choose unlimited lap swim or water aerobics in the morning from 6 to 9 AM for as long as we keep that pool open.

Oh, we're going to open it to At 6?

Yes, starting July 1st.

You know, as you know, I'm a regulator and I have not been stopped and asked that question.

What do I need to do before I—

Well, just because city employees weren't listed in that same thing, because they won't get 2 times the amount of time on their pass.

Right, right, I understand that.

But I can start— we can start using the outdoor pool at 6 AM July 1st?

July 1st, thank you.

Yes. And the pool, the surf pool stays open till what?

As long as the weather will permit.

November 30th.

Honestly, as long as the boiler can keep up with ambient air temperature.

How many miles are you going to wade to get in there?

Well, I just wade in the kiddie area.

So when we get through all the big packages in construction right now, the target is to open About the second week in January. And that's, that's really the kind of the big milestones. We can get into more detail if there's additional questions.

Okay.

A lot of pieces have to fall in place in order for this. This is a very, very fast expedited schedule.

And so it'd be nice if winter was gentle.

Can everyone pray for snow?

Yeah, we honestly— yeah, the contractors needed a good winter.

Are there sacrifices we're needing to make at the senior center, like programs that are needing to go away during this time to facilitate some of these things?

No, it's been really remarkable to kind of work together. They had a lot of downtime, so we took advantage of their downtime and programmed ours. And so coordinators at the senior center and at my facility have worked worked closely together to just integrate those and nothing— we didn't lose either. We didn't lose any actual class or program. We did change the time or tweak where they were in the building, but nothing has been sacrificed.

Nothing.

Yes, it's been great.

The senior center there is actually a lot bigger than, you know, perhaps you think looking on the outside. We held an open house just for existing passholders to come over and see and better visualize where these different programming would take place and kind of the hallway or track down in the basement that they could use to walk around. And by and large, everyone was surprised with how the facility is over there, that it'll actually be quite accommodating.

I've been there many, many, many times. I didn't know until today there was a basement. Shame on me for my ignorance. And my guess is there's a lot of people who are in the public similar to me.

So we got ceramics, woodworking machines.

Well, again, you've seen your solution longer than I have.

We'll be retrofitting the garage, Wheels on Wheels garage.

If you go to warm recreation.com, just on the top, click on that. It has— and we've been sending It has maps, it has schedules, it has what will be there, pictures, everything.

Wow, congrats.

Thank you for your efforts behind the scenes from so many of you.

So we'll be sure to try and get this information out more public too, including visuals of what the centers are.

So one thing I want to note, and it relates to some of the initial questions regarding selecting a floor plan and the building elevation. So for us to meet this schedule, we have to have a footings and foundation structural package 6 weeks from now. And so the sooner we can land— because the structural engineer hasn't begun his work, so we're asking him to do almost a record-breaking pace on getting that footings foundation package out. So we're hoping that we can You know, land on a decision. We'll also revisit the design if it's not in the right direction. We're totally open to that. But there are schedule impacts, and we're trying to move things along as quick as we can.

So maybe just to translate Joe's very polite code, there has been discussion about, do we have enough of a certain amenity? Can we build more of a certain amenity? That question really needs to find resolution quite quickly because when we talk about footings and foundations, we need to incorporate these additional courts or whatever into the program.

To that point, I have had the racquetball people tell me that they are in daily communication with you practically.

Not practically.

Okay, anyway.

Literally.

All right, anyway, so their comment was Is it really $300 a square foot to build an additional racquetball court, or can they be done for less money?

So we had Big D do a deep dive, or at least a cursory dive, from some evaluation on what the racquetball court options are. So Brennan or John, do you guys want to report on your findings?

Yeah, you bet.

So I think one of the—

what we ultimately found is after looking into it, we're About $250,000 to $300,000 per court for every court we add. Part of that is, you know, in some settings like a big health club, they'll build a big shell and then come inside and frame out some racquetball courts. That's a really inexpensive way to build a racquetball court. In this case, we don't have that luxury. We're actually increasing the footprint and coming outside. So we've got exterior walls with masonry and slabs and foundations.

So they're about 800 square feet per court?

Court, is that correct?

Yes.

And at $300 per 800, you know, $250,000 approximately. And you're basically saying $250,000 to $300,000.

And the difference there is there's 2 ways to build racquetball courts. There's like a paneling system, which we don't want, which you don't want. So that pushes you to the most expensive option ever.

So just to put it out there, we just want to—

that's what—

that's why we just want to get the truth of it out there.

Yeah, so probably you're going to be closer to $300,000 per court if that's the option that you're going to go with.

My question is, is there any economies of scale building them now versus in a phase 2 a couple years down the road?

That's your option.

Your $300,000 is your option now. Your option in the future is probably quite a bit more, significantly more.

It's $250,000 to $300,000.

$350,000.

$250,000 to $300,000. If we build it now.

And so to build it now, you need to know within 4 weeks?

I don't want to muddy the waters here, but to, to John, to your point, if the decision was made to go with the panel solution versus the concrete wall solution, then there would be some cost savings.

There would be.

There also might be, and this is beyond cost, There's flexibility with that. If something needs to be reformatted in 20 or 30 years, reformatting that floor plan is easier than if you have concrete walls.

So if we wanted to build, let's say, 5 courts versus 4 courts, and we were to go with a panel system versus a concrete system, is there a potential that we could build 5 panel for the price of 4 concrete?

Yeah, about 6.

So, so as far as timing goes, 4 weeks if you're going to add a court at this point in time.

So, um, what—

so our footings foundation package is due in 6, right?

That's why I'm saying, um, and I guess the other question is, but I mean, could we This, this also delays—

if, for example, we were to give additional time, then that also extends the pool closure time, it extends the overall opening.

So I just want to hear what time is allowed. So it's 4 weeks, you're still on schedule?

2 weeks.

Yeah, I think, I think max 2 weeks.

2 weeks?

Okay.

To zoom in on what the mayor said, If by the end of the month, uh, whoever's interested in different courts don't have a plan and funding for it, we're going ahead.

That's what I want to find out.

That's what I'm hearing. The end of the month seems like simply critical. So they have— if there's funding from the school district or some other magical source, great, let us know what it is by June 30th.

Is that 100% funding?

I think it is.

Yeah, we fund it.

Well, I think it would have to be.

Unless they want to do a panel aspect, then it's—

But, you know, just— I mean, we, you know, we can ask, but I can just tell you, panel is not popular. Nobody likes it. Everybody hates it. It might save you some bucks, but in the long run, it's—

But it's your option.

Well, it's our option.

And it's what everybody has. So what people say they hate it, They still play on it.

They do because they don't have a lot of other choices, but I can tell you it is not a good option.

Well, when you say everybody doesn't like it, everybody is a very, very small population.

Just telling you the racquetball players don't like it.

Yeah, the 10 or 12 we've been hearing from regularly.

Actually about 20.

Oh, if you build— pardon me? If you build 6 courts, What do you need to give up?

Nothing.

Nothing? Well, you just have to come up with more money. Well, I understand that, but what if they didn't come up with more money?

You could reduce other program spaces.

Yeah, so you would— we would, for example, take, uh, you know, reduce the number of family locker rooms.

2 locker rooms.

We would.

Well, I mean, my— right off the bat, my recommendation— I think our recommendation would be, okay, Okay. If you want to do more with less, then right off the bat, this goes from a concrete system to a panel system. And then you're looking at essentially making concessions on some of these other spaces, reduction in the size of, for example, studio spaces or the functional or multifunctional CrossFit spaces Or things like that, then you start to ask yourself, okay, what's the cost-benefit? If I start cutting, for example, freeway areas where I know there's going to be a very, very high volume of people all day, every day, versus racquetball where the volume's not as great, then there's going to be trade-offs.

So one of the things— You can kind of see this in the version that Joe Smith has up there.

Yeah.

You see towards the north, the different sections is related to tumbling and I think kids dancing. So in my experience at Lehigh, the recreation department, the fitness center there reported to me by far the best return in revenue for space and square footage was the tumbling gymnastics And kids dance. And so, you know, you see there on this, that would be central. And the reason why that's, you know, central and important is because of that main top priority direction you've given us of how do we bridge the gap that is currently there with between revenue and operational expense.

So one thing to remember on racquetball Right now, as an example, there's a group that plays of about 20 people that play from right around 6 to 7:30. There's another group that plays from about 7 to 8:30, and they're the more professional. The earlier are the older guys that are not so professional.

And then—

and Lissy can probably correct me— but— And then the racquetball courts sit for for most of the day until the evening when there's another group that comes in. So reality, you could do some scheduling movement there and could accommodate more people depending on if you got more of them at lunchtime. Some of the older crowd could come at lunchtime. Younger crowd could come right after school. Anyway, I mean, the courts Could be maximized to a greater extent with some scheduling adjustments.

And not to, not to suggest otherwise, Mayor, or we could leave the gymnastics space and the children's dance space and schedule it from sunup to sundown and have— I don't know how many participants you have in a class. Let's see, 20?

Yeah, 20 out there in the racquetball court. Now the problem is also racquetball courts are not multi-use.

They just can't be because of the acoustic.

We had to retrofit those with the acoustic panels.

I don't think we've been trying to consider them multi-use.

I don't know if that's what you're saying.

No, I'm just saying that we've got X amount of players per day, and so yes, they would like to play from 6:30 to 7:30, but maybe they're going to have to come They play from 11:30 to 12:30.

And a lot— they're in the hallway a lot too in terms of rotating in and out, and they're used to playing 2-on-2— I mean, 1-on-1, just 2 people on the court, and they might need to adjust and start playing doubles like we do with pickleball.

Sure. John?

Mayors, I think that Sam has been the most zealot in saying let's make a decision on this. The racquetballers have talked to all of us, I know, multiple times and claim that the Alpine School District is unhappy with how few and that they might fund. But I'm really to the point that come June 30th, if there's no additional money, we build. And if there's some money in the future, it'll cost more. I mean, as the contractors have pointed out, but, you know, we're not gonna have another meeting before that. I think we ought to be pretty resolved in what our position My position is that this is what we're building unless you come up with additional money in 2 weeks, because I'm not willing to delay the whole rec center while we quibble over 4, 6, or 8 courts.

Well, I think we've heard what Joe said, so 2 weeks and that's it.

So I can, I can comment on a, you know, a couple of informal conversations with Jess Christian and Mike Brown and Reports to Mike Brown, former principal at Orme High, and then now reports to Jess. As I've talked to them about, you know, the idea of any more money from the school district, they've said that they've been seeing the same thing we have on their school builds and those budgets coming in well over their initial estimates on those projects.

And so—

They don't have money for the rec center. They were extremely skeptical Of the idea of their ability to provide more dollars towards our project.

No, I don't think they've expressed major concern in any of those weekly meetings that we have with the racquetball courts as they are either.

To me, they've never expressed— I think they're also more intrigued with the idea of using software programming to come up with a better scheduling system and separating out over more class periods the use of Rackwell. But also, I think they're intrigued with the idea of having multiple options for their students to use.

So, I mean, not to belabor the point, but we have churches that sit vacant during the week and then they're very heavily used at certain times.

We could do that with the courts there.

That we in fact could do software that could schedule and make things, you know, maximize the use of the courts. And I think you've given us a time factor, so.

Yes, David. How much is a panel racquetball court? From our initial estimates, they're about $250,000, and then the concrete ones are about $300,000. So about $50,000 difference. So if we build the 4 cement walls and then they get the money, they need to come up with $500,000 for the back. They want 2 more. Yeah, 2 more.

But I think even on Joe's side, that the critical thing in making this decision is that they can design it when they're designing the whole building. If they decide they want to, you know, You know, build 2 more 6 months from now, that's going to be more money because Joe's going to have to go back and redesign it.

It's going to extend our durations and all that kind of stuff.

So it's not just, you know—

Are the panel courts more multi-purpose, or is it still just pretty much just for racquetball?

Just for racquetball.

But they can be changed easily.

If we had 4 concrete and then 2 panels, I was wondering if those could be more multipurpose in nature, but it doesn't sound like that's related.

So Joe, Joe was part of a team at UVU that repurposed racquetball into dance studios, and the only way he could do that, Joe, was because they were the panel-based system.

Because of the roof panel system.

So if the concrete goes up in these racquetball courts, we are proud owners of racquetball courts for the duration of the life of the facility.

Okay, so we're running out of time. Were you going to show us some elevations?

Has everyone seen the plans? Do we need to walk through the plans? How detailed do we need to go through them?

Anybody on the council want to walk through the plans?

You'll be doing that at the open house, right?

We've all seen them.

And you're looking at about 84,000 square feet?

That's what we're currently tracking, so it's fluctuating between 83 and 85. So maybe in plan we can explain how it went back, because we were about 82 for a few weeks there, and then there was some ideas that came to the table. That gave us some pretty inexpensive square footage. No complaints. It's here on the second floor.

You donate the money, you get the name.

So on the second floor, before, we had our exterior perimeter wall being here and going across right there. So what we propose to do is to take that exterior wall and move it to that location. So you're not actually spending any more money on exterior Which is your most expensive wall, right? So that enabled us to capture that, that square footage and actually put in another multipurpose studio. So that's what increased the square footage. And then that reduced our exterior wall assembly that much as well.

How big is that studio?

That's about 1,000 square feet.

How much?

1,000. And then we had some circulation. Extended down to there, and we have a little bit of square footage that we added right here. So now this is a platform for additional strength and conditioning area. So it was a pretty inexpensive way to get—

Hey, you're doing a great job.

So we think that it was a smart move.

And Joe, the outside space, can you just speak to that, the future proposed future outdoor space?

Okay.

Yeah, so the rooftop here, because we have a high wall there and a high wall here, this creates an effect called snow drift. So you potentially could have snow. So from a code standpoint, they have to design this roof system to higher load levels. So that enables us to have— they'll be designed to a load level that can have what we call a live load that's Which is a people level. So in essence, you can occupy that rooftop by the structure we're putting in there already. So that potentially gives you a rooftop area if we put pavers or something out there.

How big is that?

It's about 5,000 square feet.

So if you wanted like outdoor yoga classes at sunrise or whatever, you could accommodate that.

It's facing the south, so Getting a lot of natural light and sun down there. So that's, that's kind of being studied and explored as a potential of, you know, some added space as well. What else?

Other changes, you know, back to the first floor.

A couple of just quick highlights on the floor plan on the first floor. So we have our childcare, the York Playground. Our upper floor comes out to Hughes, so we have a little bit of covered area. So that outdoor— indoor playground, we can put an outdoor playground out there that's partially covered. So I think it's going to be a nice amenity. In addition to that, we have potential of, you know, opening up doors and creating outdoor basketball or outdoor fitness. So those are elements that we—

Yeah, the east side's really nice. And if we do save a couple of trees, that's a Wouldn't that be a beautiful area for outdoor patios?

Yeah, we think so as well. I think it's the right opportunity for a lot of things.

Can I ask a question?

Yeah.

So, so to get onto the elevated track, do you do it through that—

is that the weight room?

So yeah, there's 2 ways. So one is, um, this is your functional fitness area, the area in pink, and then they have an incline plane there. And it's, it's really for training. So it's for running up, and then there's a stair right adjacent to it. Come back down and run back up, come back down. But you can get up to the elevated track right there, either by the stair or by the elevated plane. Or you come up the stairs right here and go to the second floor. Stairs or elevator located right there, and then you either enter the track there or enter the track So the track is, uh, 1/8 of a mile long, so it's 8 laps equals a mile.

It's the same as Provo's, isn't it?

Provo's is 1/6 of a mile.

Does anybody else have the incline?

No other. The only one in the state is Dixie State's new building that they're just finishing that we're aware of, unless someone is aware of another one that I'm not acknowledging.

Just a comment. I just wanted to point out how impressed I am with the public input and the outreach that you did to understand what are the actual demands and needs on this facility. Like, as a parent of young kids, I love the way that the youth-oriented facilities are all congregated in kind of that central gathering area. It'll make it a a whole lot easier when we've got kids at different ages running around doing different things. So I'm just really impressed with the layout and the design that you have.

Okay, so we're excited. There's some great ideas that came from staff from the rec center. You know, I think a lot of lessons learned from Provo and Dehigh and other facilities as well. Any other questions on the floor plan? Do you want us to get into it any further?

I think we're good.

Let me go back. So you've got the 4 racquetballs, and what's the white area? This area here? Right hallway? No, on the—

Right there is mechanical.

Keep going up.

Keep going to the right. So just go up to the racquetball court. Yeah, north of the racquetball court.

Into the court.

This is the hall into the basketball courts.

Yeah, this one here?

Yeah, yeah.

That's so you can come from the locker rooms and go directly to the center of the courts and go one way. There's also a queuing and viewing area there. There'll be some glass here for the small dance studios for parents to observe what their kids are doing. Likewise, that lounge area, there'll be a viewing area into the future mess hall.

And you also have access to the basketball courts from the north?

Yeah, and then the basketball courts, there's a large opening there that you can access.

Okay, elevations.

So a quick look at the interior. These are just— these are fresh, hot off the presses, and they're very conceptual, but showing you what that lobby, the elevated tracks— here's your entrances, your reception. This is that team zone, the idea of having, you know, a gaming area where the So we're trying to entice and bring teens. It's the most underutilized demographic in the rec centers today. So that would be your fitness, functional fitness area. This is your lounge area. And then, you know, views to upstairs and where a lot of the cardio is occurring. So this is up on the platform. You can see the elevated running track right here, looking down at that team zone. And then you have your cardio fitness up here, basketball courts down there, additional strength training. Looking down at that, you know, your entrance reception.

Here's your control room.

Control point, it's the platform above. We're not showing it, but we have pretty incredible views out to the mountains from that north elevation. I'm excited about that. And then here's that elevated point, or that inclined plane, with stairs next to it. So this is for training purposes within that— No, no, no, I just didn't know where you were going.

Will there be a basement?

Just for storage or other purposes?

There's not. No basement. Okay.

That's creepy.

Well, I don't care what they store stuff down.

Sometimes we'll put the mechanical in the basement and we'll do it at the house, but it's going to save us money to put mechanical on grade outside of the basement.

So—

Is there—

this is an odd question— is there room for a slide Next to this, and not just from an enjoyment standpoint, but I've heard just as you're working out and trying to go down, it can be really hard on your knees if you're, you know, taking stairs or something like that. So might there be room for something like that? Sure, to get you back down.

There's an elevator.

Would you like to be swept up?

We've not done that before, but, you know, we can look at it. There were some ideas thrown out there of, uh, American Ninja Warrior, the warped wall. You know, thoughts of, you know, to reincorporate warped wall would be a pretty inexpensive thing. You'd be the only one in the state other than a couple private facilities that have warped wall. We'd have to find a place for it. So warp wall is an element that comes up like this. It's almost like a skate mat. It's 14 feet tall. It's part of the training and part of American Ninja Warrior. They run up the wall and pull themselves up.

So some outside elevations.

So we have 2 options. This is option 1. So And again, these are pretty early conceptual renderings. So a lot of glass on the north side, trying to take advantage of visibility into the facility, but also, you know, those views looking out elevated on the second floor. Really kind of a prominence of height.

From a heating and cooling system, does the glass create a challenge at all or not?

You know, I think it's going to be balanced by the percentage of glazing that happens on other elevations. So I think, and then the technology of glazing systems today is actually much better than it used to be.

So yeah, since it's north-facing, it's nice because you don't have that glare.

Joe, just another thing too, if you could mention the need to drop down to meet equal grade across the entire facility.

Yeah, so the city conducted a site survey of the elevations of the current facility and then the current grade coming from the north side, and there was a 2-foot difference from the back of curb here to the existing existing grade of the pools. So the pools are 2 feet deeper than the curb is right now. So what we talked about as a group is that ideally you would have your new facility at the same elevation and same grade as your pools so you don't have internal ramps and systems. So if we put those at the same elevation, then that means that entrance point is going to be 2 feet down From this back of curb. So right now it's being— what's that?

Potentially, we had discussions today that we thought that maybe we could even lower that.

Yeah, so, so city staff engineers are exploring regrading some of the section to try to take some of that grade off.

Okay.

In the street to try to reduce that so that we don't have as much of a sunken plaza or a sunken plaza at all. So that's still in flux, but okay, ought to be known about.

So this is one option.

What is another option?

So the second option kind of takes a different design approach. It adds a little more brick and less transparency, a little less glass here. So your entrance would be located right here. You still have that, you know, elevated glazing area, but the workout zone is down here and multipurpose and in your studios of balancing the quantity and number of glass elements.

Will you go back a slide and explain to them that that looks really, really cantilevered, but it's not as much as you think.

Is that right?

Yeah, well, so this element here is going to be carried by that column.

And how steep is that? Because my understanding—

Oh, you're talking about the angle of the roof itself?

Yes.

I mean, it's relatively flat.

But that picture before, a lot of people think it's an angle and it's not.

On the previous scheme or this scheme?

Right there.

Yeah, it's, it's, it's just the perspective. It's just the perspective because the ground's off skew a little bit.

Can you do the AV? What was the one before this again?

Uh, this one.

Okay, thank you. Just trying to do the AV.

So I have some further development on this one too that we can show you in a model. Because we had some— there were some people that had some positive feedback about the columns, and then the columns could address the—

Utility costs with the windows, is there an advantage of one or another for heating and cooling of the building, or is the glass similar to brick as far as— I'm talking about just the heat and cooling.

better performance out of solid wall from a heating and cooling standpoint, but it's become a lot closer because of the glass systems we're using today. And it could mean that balancing— I'm sorry, the amount of glass that would happen on the rest of the building is really bad.

It's just kind of next to the kitchen.

So I think as staff was having this conversation, I think the consensus, Lissy, from staff— I wasn't in this meeting— was that part of the meeting was the more glass alternative is the one that people were kind of gravitating to.

So this is showing that potentially to the amount of canopy that was going out there, we could add a couple columns that actually could have some banners or flags or some sort of thing that you then could add another detail to that.

So, Joe, if I could, I'd like to just hear what the initial responses are from the council as to what they like and don't like. And Brent, could we go to you first? So this is option 1. Option 2 is the one that has brick.

Are there just 2 options or were there 3?

And then keep in mind that we could, like, for example, option 1, we could add brick, and for option 2, we could add more glass. You know, it's a different approach to the sort of volumes. This one takes that upper volume, cants it a little bit towards Timpanogos, where the other one remains a little flatter.

So just—

I think I like the second option if you can add some more brick.

That's the first option. First option feature.

So again, to say first, that's this one, correct, Brent?

Okay, thank you.

Okay, Mark, what are your thoughts?

I like this one.

Debbie?

I would like a little more brick. I like the idea of the natural light, but to me it's a little too window-heavy on this one area.

I like option 1 the way it is.

Sam?

I like option 1 the way it is, and part of that is not just the experience of looking at it from the outside, but when you're actually in the facility using it, I like being able to see the mountains and the natural light coming in.

And one thing to that is we've got a tremendous panorama of mountains that hardly anybody else has. You'd hate to not use that.

I concur. with what's— comments made thus far.

And I don't need more brick. If the energy cost is not too foolish, I think the ability to look out and see what's around you makes working out a whole lot funner.

I like one too.

And I would say the millennials love glass, so—

but I think—

That's because their mother cleaned it.

But I think having those views would be awesome. And to that point, at UVU, this is kind of what they've done as well, and it's turned out very well. So I think we kind of had a consensus that we like number 1, and you could look at variations, you know, but I think that's where we'd like to go.

Is there a possibility of having 2 open houses? I mean, you're having one, can you have one that way?

So one thing I also failed to mention too is we are kind of doing a virtual open house too. So when people over the next few days, they come into the center, we're going to provide them with access to an online essentially feedback tool where they can go to a website or they can get a QR code, scan it, go to a site and leave specific feedback As to, you know, the different amenities and such. So it won't be just a moment of 2 hours in time. If you, if you walk in on Tuesday, well, we're going to have these materials out all the next, all the next week. So if you walk by on Tuesday and you see this and you go, oh, I'd like to make a comment, there's going to be a way for you to make a comment on Tuesday. You don't have to go to the meeting on Thursday.

Okay.

Anything else?

I think that's okay.

Could we have one of those chat with a bureaucrat sessions on Facebook or something like that too?

I imagine we could.

Yeah, I think that'd be good.

Anyway, appreciate very much, uh, coming, and I'm sure we'll be doing more talking.

So just generally, is everyone—

So for printing, that's what I'm going to say. So for the foam boards that we're going to put walking in the fitness center, use option 1.

Correct?

That is our—

for the foam boards for next week. So Scott, if you can get those to me, we'll get them to Steven, whatever.

And you're generally comfortable with the floor plan?

Yes, generally.

Yes.

Okay, well, thank you very much. We need to move on and certainly appreciate you being here.

Got 2 weeks right now.

It's programmed in concrete.

So let's go ahead if we could and We're running out of time, but Tom wants to pray after.

We can go here.

Okay.

All right, Mark, could we have you do us a prayer?

Gentlemen, ladies, we're having a blessing.

We're going to have a quick prayer.

Father in heaven, grateful for this chance we have to meet, for the many hours of effort and time and work and talent that have gone Presentations.

We're grateful for those efforts, grateful for the positive things that are happening here in this beautiful city of Orem and the opportunity we have to, to work to improve and to make this a— continue to make this a great place to live. We're grateful for the food. We ask Thee to bless it, to strengthen our bodies, and do us good. We pray this in the name of Jesus Christ, amen.

You can grab your food and sit down quickly so we can go through the rest of the So if we can start into our agenda while we're eating, we were going to have a report from Tom. We can still give you 5 minutes if you want to go right now real quick.

Yeah, I can do it quick if you'd like. Members of the council, I think you all know about the Heritage Committee. That's one of the ones I have responsibility for. They do a great Memorial Day and a great Labor Day day program. I think, I think we were all there for the Memorial Day. Did a great job. So I don't know that there needs to be much report on that.

Veterans Day, not Memorial Day.

Oh, you're right. Thank you. Memorial Day and Veterans Day.

Thank you for the corrections.

And then I'm on the hospital board, which they do a great job of a lot of community awareness and relationship with the community. I'm grateful I'm proud to be on that board. I've been on that for a little bit. I serve on another board very similar in my private life, and I think it's good to have that mix. And then Paul was just here, and I'm on the Transportation Committee. I'm grateful for, um, for my involvement with that. But again, you hear from Paul regularly, so I think you know what's going on there. I think you know what's going on with the Heritage. So that's my brief report, Mayor, unless there's other questions about that.

Thank you. This is with the hospital, um, Forum community and the futsal and the park. Are they on board with the— is it the walking path? And they were going to fund some little fitness things. Do you know?

Yes, they talked about that a couple months ago. We've had a change in chairman and that hasn't come back up again. I'd be happy to bring that up next time, Debbie.

Thank you.

By the way, we have other Forum, uh, representations on there, a member of our police chief, Chief— not police chief, a member of the police department comes to that. I'm trying to remember who.

Which one is it?

Which committee?

The hospital.

Trent.

And then Kenneth Joe comes to that as well. So we have quite a bit of representation there.

So I think it might be true.

So thank you, Tom. Appreciate your work on that. Appreciate the report.

No, it's Ned Jackson.

Yeah, that's right.

We'll pass on the upcoming events. I'll just I'm not going to read those tonight. There's 4 of them. We do have a report from the Senior Advisory Commission. We have 4 items on the consent items. 1, approval of our meeting minutes, May 28th, 2019. 2, appointment of a new mayor pro tem. Appreciate Clay Spencer's work this past 6 months. I would suggest Brent Sumner. Anybody have any objections or approvals?

Second.

Everybody okay with that?

Yeah.

Okay.

Appointments to boards and commissions. We have Craig Hewish to the Senior Advisory Commission. I believe that's a new appointment. Anybody know him? He has worked for a long time in the food services, worked at the Woodbury School of Business at UVU.

What's his name again?

His name is Craig Hewish. Douglas Craig Hewish, and longtime resident.

This recommendation came from Carl Hurst.

Okay, if you're okay with that, we'll move forward. And then lastly, a resolution authorizing the execution of an interlocal cooperation agreement to authorize Orem's participation in Utah Valley Home Consortium and the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development's Home and Investment Program for federal fiscal years 2020, 2021, 2022. Everybody okay with that?

Check, check, check.

Okay, moving on. We have 5 public hearings and 2 resolutions. Brandon Nelson, first public hearing is amending the current fiscal year budget. Normal stuff.

It's our transfer of our reserves from—

Right.

Financial results from fiscal '18 to the CIP fund. So that's obviously a big item, normal but a big item. We have $1 million for the water reuse project that was provided by Metro Water, and so that includes that. And the third big item is the transfer of the Friends of This is the library money, capital projects fund for the library project.

Great. Just in passing, Jamie and I were having dinner with Mayor— or lunch with Mayor Cafoussi and with Wayne Parker from Provo City, and Karen and Alan Ashton just happened to be sitting in the building right across from us at La Jolla Groves. And so I had a very good conversation with both of them and thanked them for their donation. They're enthused about the library halls moving forward. So the next one is a public hearing vacating 590 East between 1000 South and 1100 South, as well as a portion of 1100 South between 590 East and the west side of 545 East. This has to do with the University Place Mall. For the Woodberries, Grant, Alan—

Grant is here.

Would you like to tell us?

Sure.

So Woodberries is preparing to, in addition to restructuring some financial blocks for financial purposes, they adjusted their flats. They just did this for future plans to anticipate Anticipate the theater potentially coming there. That is the purpose of this street vacation. And negotiated with them to have some easements. There's majors, groups, other facilities that are going through there.

And just so everybody knows, they own all the homes along there, correct?

Correct. They own all the homes.

They're adding the street to the homes.

There is a— in my slides, there's a development The letter, agreement letter that we had them come through today is proposed turnaround for the North Street there, temporary turnarounds that will be put in by them. And then depending on some future acquisition of properties in the north, they potentially would move it and then it would become permanent after that.

Okay, the next one we have is a public hearing as well. Taking 7.89 acres of property located along the East Timpanogos Parkway from a PD-6 zone to a PRD zone, going from a business to a residential. Grant, do you want to mention something about that?

It's 32 single-family homes, which would be about 4 units per acre, significantly less than 7 units per acre, which is The loud noise priority zone. And the Canyon Park, which is right adjacent to that, is northeast, northwest. They've worked into a development agreement for that parking lot for the existing Canyon Park. And the There's a landscape buffer there between the homes and the canyon.

Mayor, can I just give a minute? We'll just give a minute to Steve Earle, who has an issue that's kind of tied to this.

Yeah, it's, uh, just so you know, there in Planning Commission, there was a gentleman by the name of Jim Chatterley who came and spoke to this, this issue. Basically asked the Planning Commission if solar would be permitted and if this were a What would be considered a green zone? Solar. And it's kind of an odd question, but what he does, he's an engineer and he's designed or is in the process of designing a prototype of a solar-mounted solar array basically on a 7-foot pedestal and then movable panels that rotate with the sun. And it's basically, the design he gave us is about 22 feet high. The reason he's The reason he came and asked that question was he's previously come in and talked to staff about wanting to do that basically in his neighborhood in a residential zone.

He wants to put it on his neighbor's property.

And basically it's used to charge cars and that sort of thing.

And we've told him no, because basically what this is, is a prototype that he wants to test. And at 22 feet high, you know, we're just a little bit concerned about you know, the stability, what happens, you know, if a big wind comes up and things like that. And so we said the proper place to test a prototype like this is in a wind tunnel.

But basically he was raising it at that Planning Commission because he's upset with me in particular.

I came forth telling him he couldn't do it in a residential zone. And so he may come and raise that issue again tonight. So, okay.

It really has nothing to do with whether the property should be rezoned.

So I just don't want us to get off track trying to figure out what his question is and trying to answer it at this point.

Okay, so our next one is a public hearing on amending, um, the Orange City Code for Baxter Gardens. If you remember, this came before the council before, and the PRD zone allows 7 units They wish to put in 6.02 units per acre. And they are nice-looking structures, nice-looking homes. Grant, did you want to—

I think the only thing I would add is they initially sought 13 units, and that was before, I believe, from the comments from the owners, they They had switched developers, and so they had a neighborhood meeting. The neighbors weren't so excited about the 13 units, so the new developer held another meeting, compromised with the neighbors, and they were also initially seeking 2-story units, went down to 1-story, and the neighbors were really grateful for the developer working with them. And a few of them actually came out and voiced positive comments of the Planning Commission and support of the developer working with them and also the request. Right.

It seems like we used to hear in these notes the Planning Commission recommended or did not recommend.

There's a different page that that stuff is still on.

Okay.

I'm just not correct.

It's in the back room. Okay, thank you, guys.

Okay, the next one is a public hearing, um, removing Section 7010 from the Uniform Building Code, um, and sections— adding Chapter 18, Sections 1803 and 1804, International Building Code. Grant?

Uh, so reference code in our subdivision The ordinance is an outdated state—

outdated code. This is merely to match the state adopted building code for the subdivision ordinance pertaining to hillside developments.

Okay.

10.6 is a resolution at Sleepy Ridge, site approval of Golden Pond Phase 7 located at 19 Um, Grant, you want to go over that?

Uh, yeah, so this is, uh, the final phase, I believe, of the Golden Pond properties in the PD-15 zone. It is a private, uh, private parcel. It's just 8 twin-home units. The units are one-story. Uh, sorry, the seats are 2-story, 7 and 8 are 1-story. Um, and, uh, let's see, and the density, um, I've got it on my other sheet. Um, there was some comments of the Planning Commission, uh, in opposition based on the neighbors, um, uh, and issues The HOA has accepted this property into their group, into their HOA, and there is some supporting documentation provided in the packet to show that. Some of the comments were regarding that, that acceptance into the HOA. There's also some comments about that this was— this is a state park. And that it's been used as open space by the current HOA, and it actually is privately held parcel. The other comments were related to a little bit about traffic and how on that street, it's a private street. And then the owner has met with HOA several times and The project proposal for this project has been widely available for all members of the HOA before they were even accepted into the application well over a year ago.

He's held several meetings, and then the open meeting was held back in May prior to the final meeting.

And Mayor, if I may too, just This property was— the conversation was initiated with the HOA to say, look, we recognize that you're interested in this being a park. Is the HOA interested in purchasing this property? And the HOA respectfully declined and said, well, we can't afford that. So the landowner moved forward with his proposal.

So—

Okay.

This idea that this is a park The HOA was approached and they were asked, are you interested in purchasing the park? And the HOA responded no.

Okay, and so then the last one is a resolution on a conditional use permit for an accessory structure, 1,776 square feet, located at 466 East 1,500 North. This is a building containing a living room, bedroom, 2-car garage, Guest house, pool house, and pool equipment.

Um, Brent? As you're aware, uh, P.D.— a couple of P.D. zones, any, uh, structure, accessory structure over 1,000 square feet requires conditional use permit approval from City Council. Um, this is a pool house. I thought it was interesting that it's 1,776 square feet. It's covering 4% of the lot and is well within the requirements of the accessory structure zone.

Okay, Tammy, do you have anything? Okay, and then, uh, we'll have a closed-door meeting after our regular meeting with the city manager evaluation. With that, let's go ahead and close and move to our city council chambers.

Mayor, since I have everybody here, can I just mention that about an hour and a half ago, a Highway Patrol trooper was going through 800 North State and got T-boned in the intersection. There was no major injuries, but if you happen to hear that there was a patrol car in a bad accident on 800 North, not my guys.

Mayor, was it the—

was it the other driver's I just talked to him.

He's not going to make it.

We would like to welcome everyone out to our City Council session this evening and would like to call this meeting to order. We would like to begin by having a prayer by Brent Sumner, after which the Pledge of Allegiance will be given by Councilmember Debbie Lurie.

Our kind and eternal Heavenly Father, we're indeed grateful for the opportunity we have to meet together as a city council and, and members of our community. And we ask thee to be with us tonight, that what is discussed and decided, that it'll benefit our community and make it a much better quality of life and place to live. And Father, we're thankful for all our wonderful blessings and thy guidance and, and thy inspiration. And we ask thee to be with us this night. In the name of Jesus Christ, amen.

Amen.

All rise. Please join me in the Pledge of Allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Thank you, Brent, and thank you, Debbie. We would like to go over the upcoming events, uh, in the city. We hope that everyone had a chance to participate and be part of our Summerfest activities this past week. It was a It was a great time and a lot of people really enjoyed it. Coming up on June 20th, we have our City of Orem Police picnic at the Hillcrest Park at 5:30 PM. On June 21st, we have the Canyon Park Technology Center opening at 11 AM. On June 27th, we have the Suncrest Police picnic at the community park at 5:30 PM. And on July 11th, 11th. We have the City of Orem Police, Lake Ridge Police picnic at the Westmore Park at 5:30 PM. We would now like to give some time to our Senior Advisory Commission, and we have Gina Berthelsen and Kay Bradford here to present. They would like to come forward.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

And you could sit here or stand. I know Kay doesn't like to—

Listen, Kay does not stand.

She moves, and she moves well and gracefully. I'm not the star of this show.

This show belongs totally to the wonderful, vivacious, and lovely Ms. Kay Bradford. So I'm just going to turn the time over to her.

Great. And she is our commission chair. Nice to have you here, Kay.

Oh boy, I'm so happy to be here. I got up this morning, I said, this is my lucky day. I get to be here with all you wonderful, wonderful people. My gosh, I just love our Arm Senior Friendship Center.

We do too.

When you all get 55 or older— you're too young now—

but when you get 55 or older, When we get to be that age, we'll come.

That day will come. Anyway, I just absolutely love that center. And our— we have such wonderful times over there. And it's because of my good friend here, Gina. Stand up here. I got a badge. If I can find it. You're the greatest.

Oh, thank you.

There you go. And also Carl, he's not here, so I'm not going to say anything about him. But he's pretty good too. We love Carl. Carl and Gina actually make our Friendship Center go. And also, I want to say, um, I think they need a raise. I think— is it Mr. Davidson? I think you better think about this very seriously. They devote their whole time to that. And so think real hard about a raise for her. Okay. Do you realize that we are the largest, most active Senior center in Utah. We have 3,413 members. Did you get that?

3,413.

We have an average attendance of over 400 people every day. We serve over 1,000 meals every month. And we have over 800 a month playing bingo. on Tuesday and Thursday. They love bingo. And when you get older, you do kind of like bingo. How about— anyway, this past year we started something really great. It was called our Brilliant University. And we had all kinds of classes. We had classes in writing your personal history, ukulele, Watercoloring, writing your personal history, and on and on and on. But next, we're going to start— next September, we'll start again and have our second semester of our Brilliant University. And then we're going to be really brilliant. Of course, a big drawing card is our Grammys. Every March, we have these wonderful Grammys, and we all dress up, and we just love it. And this year was better than ever because we had Frank Sinatra singing I'll Do It My Way.

He—

let's see. Yeah, he did it his way. We do it our way, don't we? But he did it his way anyway. And coming up on June 21st, we're gonna have a really exciting picnic in the park. Gina is going to cook the hot dogs because it's our Flamingo Days. And she's cooking the hot dogs. Debbie is making a potato salad and we'll have all the trimmings. So if you're 55 or older, you can come, but you got to make a reservation. You know, everybody likes a compliment, and I think that's why our center is so successful, because everyone that comes into that door, Gina and the whole staff of Debbie and Kitty and Peggy, they all greet those people with, you're wonderful, you're beautiful, you're top-notch. And that makes people feel good. Do you feel good when you get a compliment?

Yes.

You bet you do. And so, let's see. I have a list of these positive words and I want you all to use Just hand them to Tom.

He'll pass them out. So Kay, these are very good, terrific, marvelous words. Thank you.

Along with that, along with that, we have our motto, and this is our motto. Our motto is, oh, Be swift to love. Make haste to be kind.

So here, he'll he'll pass them out.

So be kind to everyone. Now let's see what comes next. Oh, I've got to thank the mayor, the city council, the police people, the firemen, and everyone, the council, for the wonderful Summerfest we had. It was the best we've ever had.

Can we have a round of applause for that?

That was absolutely the best we've ever had. I just loved every minute of it. Great. And Brent Summers, I think you deserve a badge too because you were part of that. So let's give— pass him a badge, will you? Okay. Now—

You can pin it on him, Brent.

Bob.

Now, since my time is limited, we have the most fantastic newsletter that any company ever had, all in color. It tells you all exactly what's going on every day, every week. So we have to do some more passing out. There you go. Thank you. Can you get somebody to tip you over here?

There you go.

How about— Oh, I almost forgot, my gosh. No one can go hungry here because every day at the center we have bread, rolls, donuts, fruit, salad.

Free!

Free! It's all free. So we just enjoy that. We get up from tai chi and come up and have our donut or our— whatever we want to have. You know, I went to Harry Potter Land and I picked up—

A wand.

A magic wand. I'm going to bless each and every one of you with peace, Happiness, peace and joy and happiness and good times and fun.

Thank you. That's awesome.

Thank you.

That's what it's all about. Enjoy every moment of your day. Now, let me tell you, there's nothing like laughter. So I have to close with one of my favorite jokes, which I think is so funny.

Okay.

Doug Smith is on his deathbed and knows the end is near. His nurse, his wife, his children are with him. He asks for 2 witnesses to be present. to record his last wishes. And when all is ready, he speaks. My son Bernie, I want you to take the Merri Fair houses. My daughter Sybil, you take the apartments over in the East End. My son James, I want you to take the offices over in the city center. And Sarah, my dear wife, you get all the residential buildings on the banks of the river. The nurse and witnesses are blown away as they did not realize his extensive holdings. As Doug passed away, the nurse says, Mrs. Smith, your husband must have been a very successful man to have accumulated all this property. Property? Sarah replied. The idiot had a paper route. Thank you very much. I love you. I love you all. You're just wonderful. Don't forget about that raise, Mr. Davidson.

Okay, thank you. I know that you have a lot of fun over at the Senior Citizen Center. Thank you, Gina, for all you do, and thank you, Kay. We'd now like to move on to our personal appearance portion of our meeting. We would ask that those who come up to speak hold their comments to 3 minutes and give us your name when you come forward. And the first one is Sean Heaton, followed by Val Gibson.

Before Kay leaves, I wanted to see if I could borrow her magic wand for a minute. Or get her interested in a game of racquetball. We could use her on our side. She's great. I wish that you guys could have been there a couple days ago when the mayor come out, donned on his shorts, brought an old '50s-style racquetball— racquet, and come and played with us. We thought that was pretty cool. And I learned a few things. I mean, you could tell in the day he could really move around that court. You give him another year and he'll be beating us. Mayor, thank you. I appreciate you coming.

You bet. It was a lot of fun.

Thank you. It was. And, you know, that just sent a good signal to us that you're interested in. I think that you maybe got a feel for what we've been trying to portray. You know, we can only say words, but when you come down and play with us, you can actually feel. There's a— we had a bunch of guys there that day, and I mean, if we were to all play individually, we would have filled up every court that was there, wouldn't we?

Mm-hmm.

But we just love each other. We play a lot of foursome. I want to thank Debbie, coming down again for a second time visiting with us. Mark came down and we had some interesting conversation. We appreciate him coming down. There's a couple of you we still haven't seen yet come down. Come down, Sam, Spencer, or David, sorry. Come down, put your racquetball shorts on and come play with us. I think— I was there.

I went and nobody was there.

Morning time. You don't want to come in the mornings, right? The middle of the day, almost every— you know, the whole facility is empty, right? I think we can all agree to that.

Okay?

Middle of the day, you know, there's a lot of people not there. But you'll see in the morning time when people are off of work, evening times, good time to come. So come down here, bring it, we'll play with you. We'd love to have you come down. Appreciate the meeting that we had with the mayor and Debbie here a couple days ago. I thought it was very productive. You know, it was a positive meeting in a sense that you guys know how we feel. We've got a few racquetball guys who've raised your hand because most of the people want to come and share their feelings. Once we found out about the June 27th, we were going to pack it tonight. But now we found out about the public meeting on June 27th, I think you'll see a few more of us there. And that's probably be more appropriate at the time. But anyway— I'm sorry.

Just—

we're working forward to be positive to get some more courts. And we appreciate those of you who are on board. If we can find the money— and we'll get you, Sam. We'll get you. If we can find the money, that you'll work with us. And we're working hard out there. We're funding our— starting our own GoFundMe page.

Okay.

It might not amount to much. 'Cause really what we need to get out there is get some public contributions. Uh, talked to, uh, some of the athletic guys today. Uh, the 4 courts, it's just gonna be very difficult for them to work. I mean, you can imagine the guys showing up and only having just a few spin things and a few rackets. That's how we're gonna fill the first day. There's just still the 4 courts gonna be packed with guys. Anyway, I wanna thank you. You'll hear more of us.

Thank you.

on June 27th. And I told Joseph Smith just to stub everything in. Don't finish it off completely because we're going to try to find the money. Thank you.

Thank you, Sean. Val Gibson.

Hi, I'm Val Gibson, and I appreciate you letting me talk to you for a few minutes today. A couple of you that know me know that, like, I'm an old-school TV, you know, you gotta turn on, wait 20 minutes to warm up, and the tube goes out and shorts things out. And that's the way my brain sort of thinks. And most of the racquetball players hate me. In fact, they're getting so bad they won't even let me play with them anymore.

That's true.

Because, you know, I'm like way out there. As I've started looking at this process, I've got a— and I know you won't answer these questions today, but I want you to at least think about them. You probably all have my email. I would like you to respond if you would. But as I looked at this process and understand as short-circuited as I am, I really had— I looked at it that, you know, the city gets their authority from the state. And as I was looking at this, I didn't see where the state gave the city authority to tear down the racquetball or the rec center. And, you know, they do— or to even issue a bond to do that. You know, they allow you to acquire a rec center. They require you to improve. Improve— well, you've already acquired it, so it's really hard to do that again. You can improve it, which is construction. Well, you've already constructed it. it, so I rule that out. Or you can repair it, and it desperately needs repair. Or you can extend it. And really, those are the only items that the state allows you to do to the rec center. And so I'm just asking you to rethink about it and, and get back to me on what gives you the authority to, to do anything beyond that. And As far as the disposition of the bonds, you know, paying the bond money out, that could be a real serious issue if you weren't really authorized to do what you were supposed to do. And, you know, so there again, I think you need to sort of, you know, take a look and think about it. And I know I've only got a few minutes, and so this is really brief, and I've got a longer version of this, and I'll email it to you. When I actually finalize it. But, you know, it appears through me the process that there was also a number of, uh, city ordinances that were violated, and those city ordinances could actually equate to a violation of Ordinance 2-6-6, which has really severe consequences. And, you know, I know my time's up, but I'm willing to talk about it. privately or as a group or whatever you want to do so I understand this, because I'd like to understand it. And, and then these people can get off my back because they think I'm crazy. And thank you, and talk to you later.

Thank you, Val. We'll now go ahead and close the personal appearance portion of our meeting and move forward to our consent items. We have 4 consent items. Is there anyone on the council who wishes to move any of these items over to a regular schedule? If not, I will read the 4 consent items. The first is the approval of meeting minutes, City Council, May 28th, 2019. The second is the appointment of a new mayor pro tem to serve from July through December 2019, and that would be Councilmember Brent Sumner. And we thank Councilmember Dave Spencer for the service he's given the last 6 months. We have an appointment to a board and commission, and that is D. Craig Hewish to the Senior Citizens Advisory Commission. And lastly, we have a resolution authorizing the execution of an interlocal cooperation agreement to authorize Orem's participation in the Utah Valley Home Consortium and the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development's Home Investment Program for federal fiscal years 2020, '21, and '22. I would like to make a motion that we approve these consent items. Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilmember Lentz.

Aye. Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Okay, these items pass. We'd now like to move into the scheduled items of our program. The first one is 10.1, which is a public hearing on an ordinance amending the current fiscal year 2018-19 budget, and Brandon Nelson is our presenter, and Richard Manning will be assisting.

Good evening.

Thank you, Mayor. So we come before you this evening with our last budget amendments for the fiscal year 2018-19.

The first—

you can see the items I want to discuss are in— I'll go through them based on the items that you can see, the note column, in relation to most of the things that we normally do throughout the year. That we come to you with budget amendments for, primarily in Note 1, which relate to grants and donations, etc., that we've received throughout the year. Those are all the items listed as number 1. Nothing out of the ordinary.

They're pretty—

the normal stuff we have each— generally each quarter. Um, and then, are there, are there any questions with any of those? Those are pretty standard. Items 2, 3, and 4 are the, the main items I wanted to cover this evening. Right there at the top of the screen, item number 2. We have received $1 million from Metro Water for use in our water reuse project. This budget amendment simply recognizes the Brandon, Councilor MacDonald has a question.

Could you scroll back just a little bit? There was a high dollar amount. Oh, you're going to get back to that. Sorry. Thank you.

So then if there's no questions related to that, item number 3, note 3, is related to the Friends of the Library and the funds that were left in that fund with the vacation of the Timpanogos Storytelling Festival. And those funds have been allotted to go towards construction of the library hall. This simply moves the funds from the Friends of the Library fund to the capital projects fund so that they can be spent towards that construction. And then Item number 4, right here at the top of the screen, relates to the $4.6 million, relates to our fiscal '18 end results from our financials and the transfer of the funds from the general fund to our capital projects fund. Approximately $2.2 million of that is related to the state requirement, the ceiling on the amount of fund balance that we can— we have available. So $2.2 million of that needs to be moved just so that we fall underneath that ceiling. The remaining $2.4 million gets us to the targeted 15% reserve amount that we have— we kind of target as a city as an adequate amount within our general fund. That can then be used towards the capital— various capital projects that will be identified. Are there any questions in relation to that item? Okay, that's all I have.

Okay, this is a public hearing, so I would like to open it up to the public. Anyone who would like to come forward and speak on this particular ordinance is welcome to do so. Keep your comments to 3 minutes and list your name. Seeing as how no one's coming forward, we'll close the public comment portion of our public hearing and bring it back to the council. Any comments from the council? Councilmember Sumner.

Will those capital project monies be used in this next budget year?

Correct, in fiscal year 2020.

All of it will be used during—

Yeah, so they'll be then rolled forward, those projects that have been identified, that are identified, and/or those funds will stay within that capital projects fund and then be utilized. Quite honestly, they probably won't actually get utilized till either late in 2020 or possibly into 2021 because just because of the number of projects that we're currently working on. But eventually they will.

They've all been identified?

Correct.

Okay, City Manager Jamie Davidson.

Now, Brandon, just for the point of clarification for Councilmember Sumner's question, some of these projects are parks-related, some of them are road-related, some of them are tied to city facilities and infrastructure.

Now, I, I also recall, recall that there is some unallocated amount that is going into our budget as well.

Correct.

I, I should have clarified.

You're right.

Thank you. So about $1.5 million of the $4.6 It is not specific to a specific project. It's obviously being moved to the capital projects fund for future identification of what capital project needs we may have that that money can be used for. So it's about $1.5 million of that.

Okay, any questions or further comments from the council? Councilor Lurie.

So if I remember correctly, and correct me if I'm wrong, the state cap for our rainy fund is 25%, correct? And so, and our goal is to keep it at 15%, correct? So the 10%, um, is what we're moving over, correct? All right, thank you.

Okay, if there's no further questions, I would accept a motion.

Mayor, I would move then that we amend the current fiscal year 2018-2019 budget as proposed.

Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilmember McDonald.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Ordinance passes. We'll move on. Thank you, Brandon and Richard. We'll move on to our next public hearing. This is an ordinance vacating 590 East Street located between 1000 South and 1100 South, as well as that portion of 1100 South between 590 East and the west side of 545 East Street. And our presenter is Grant Allen.

Good evening.

Thank you, Mayor.

Let's see.

So as I've showed here on the screen, this is currently 590 East connecting to 1000 South and 1100 South. The applicant is University Mall Shopping Center.

Can we have the applicant come forward and sit there with you?

Thank you.

So they're seeking vacation of this property. They've purchased all the homes on the west side of 590 East and also homes on the portion of 1000 South as well as 1100 South for future redevelopment. So the purpose of the vacation would be to allow that for— as part of their platting process to— for future redevelopment, as well as an agreement that we've made with them for existing public utilities that run down that street. And the— so the city council may vacate the street if it finds there's good cause for the vacation and the vacation will not be detrimental to the public interest. Development Services recommends the city council vacate this parcel. In addition to— as part of this condition, as we went through through development services review process. There is the permanent cul-de-sac location proposed here, as you see, location about approximately spring 2021. And between now and then, this is the location of the temporary cul-de-sac location that will be existing towards the north of Yes. 590 East there intersecting with 1000 South. And there's this image showing the portion of the road to be vacated, as well as the legal description. And as I said, the development review— development services recommends that City Council vacate.

So could you go back 2 slides, if you would? That one right there. So, Kathy, my question is, these other homes here on the west side of the red line, those are homes you do not own— Woodbury does not own, is that correct?

The lines on the west side of the red line we do not own, correct.

The homes on the west side of the red line.

Okay.

And they're aware of this proposed action? Obviously, they've been contacted, so yes.

Okay.

All right. Any questions from the council?

Okay.

Councilmember Debbie Lurie.

I'm assuming that these homes will be demolished sooner than later.

What's your timeline?

They were leased up until June 1st, and those leases have They're expired now, and so we're in the process of tearing them down. Are you planning on putting parking there, or what's your plans immediately? Do you have one? Probably the— this site is basically to consolidate the land for the Hale Center Theater, and it would be used for parking when Hale Center goes in. We are thinking that we might— that we'll probably pave it. This summer we'll put We're not going to put the wall up this summer and pave it this summer, just because with the new office building that we want to bring to Planning Commission next week, we'd like to use— we'd like to use the area for storing, you know, construction materials and things for them.

Okay.

Thank you.

Any other questions from the council? All right. Well, this is a public hearing, so we'll open it up for public comment. Anyone wishing to come forward, please give us your name and Hold your comments to 3 minutes. Seeing how— as how no one is coming forward, we'll close the public comment portion of our public hearing and bring it back to the council. Would anyone care to make a motion? I'll make a motion. I would like to move that the ordinance be passed for vacating 590 East Street, located between 1000 South and 1100 South, as well as that portion of 1100 South between 590 East and the west side of 545 East Street. Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilmember McDonald.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye. Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

The ordinance passes. Thank you, Grant, and thank you, Kathy. Move on to item number 10.3. Which also is a public hearing on an ordinance amending Section 22-5-3A and the zoning map of the City of Orem by changing the zoning on approximately 7.89 acres of property located generally at 759 East Timpanogos Parkway from the PD-6 Timpanogos Research and Development Park zone to the PRD, Planned Residential Development zone. and amending Appendix KK of the Orem City Code by adding Abbey Road Townhomes PRD concept plan and elevations. And Grant Allen is our presenter.

Thank you, Mayor.

So the applicant is proposing to rezone the property to a PRD from the PD-6 zone. Proposed development is just This is the location as well as the zoning map. So it's currently vacant as well as part of a parking lot. And then here's the proposed concept plan showing 32 single-family homes. It's approximately 4.03 units per acre. That's significantly less than the maximum which is allowed in the— 7 units per acre. They are single-story units, approximately 1,900 square feet on the main level, and then we'll have basements. And then the heights are 24 feet approximately. And staff has also been working with the neighboring property owner to the northwest, which is Canyon Park. Just go back here.

Sorry.

On a buffer here along this PRD buffer along here for the parking lot. And that agreement was— has been made. And just to show you that, this is an exhibit of that development agreement showing the buffer along there with the Canyon Park Business Park and the new area for the PRD zone.

Thank you.

Planning Commission was in favor of this and recommended the City Council approve the rezone of this property.

Mr. McDonald, did you—

I wondered if the applicant was here to sit with—

I don't know. Is the applicant here?

I think that's who I was thinking was the applicant.

Sure, come on forward. Okay. If you just want to have a seat with Grant there. Any questions from the council? Councilmember Lentz?

I've got one, and I apologize because this is going to be a bit of a historical question that you might not be as familiar with, so I'm not sure— Steve, maybe, if you might be the best person. As I recall, a couple years ago, we had voted on a different site in the same neighborhood that was proposed for housing. We had initially voted against that. A similar proposal came back to the council that was about twice the size and included that area plus another one, and the council voted in favor of that one. I was thinking that this plot of land was part of that second proposal, but I must have had my coordinates off or something like that. So is there a way that you could show us on the map maybe what we had already approved for housing? Would that be possible?

Well, I think Grant should have a zoning map, a current zoning map that would show the locations that are currently zoned RD.

So are you thinking of that bare ground right across from it on the left?

And I guess I was thinking that the part that was in red, that that was, I guess, also part of that that second proposal that was brought to us.

You said a couple years ago, but a couple months ago this came before you to change the general plan. And I'm not sure if that's what you're thinking of, but—

OK.

The time I was thinking of, I was kind of the accidental mayor pro tem because the mayor couldn't be here. I think Tom was serving as the pro tem but had to step away. And so I was kind of filling in. But I was just trying to understand the history of that, if that was part of those discussions or if that was just a You know, I don't recall for sure.

I mean— I can mention that. So that particular piece of property to the left here— well, you have the green line around, and then to the left is a bare piece of property. Chatwin Homes bought that property, and they are developing it. At one time, they were looking at trying to buy a company, a group that runs a small charter school, Arches, was trying to buy that land together with the building just to the east of it to put in a charter school, and that was refused. But then later, the land itself was sold for a development of retirement homes, which they are developing now, and we have approved.

So is that part of the PD-6 then? I'm just trying to understand why the homes would be part of a PD-6 zone.

They wouldn't be. Nothing, nothing that's in PD-6 would be developed as housing right now because they would have to have been rezoned out either into a new PD zone that allowed residential units or into the PRD zone.

And one other thing we did do is Unicity right there, which is the white-roofed building. We— they wanted to get out of the HOA that they were in. Which we approved. So, right, anyway.

So I guess on the, the map to the right, all those little squares that are in that parcel just to the west of what's, you know, with the red dots there, what are those squares?

So that's what's been approved for Chatwin Homes to put in a new retirement home, mostly subdivision, and they are in the process They are building that right now.

Maybe I'm not understanding that map then. Is that not a PD-6?

It's been rezoned to a PRD.

OK. That's probably where my confusion is coming from then, because I'm— I thought those were homes, and the map appears like they're commercial still. But OK.

They are homes.

Long-winded—

question and answer, but thank you for that.

Councillor MacDonald, did you have a comment?

Yes, just for some of the— I did have to recuse myself several times on voting in this piece, but as a matter of public record, I've sold my interest in that property, and so I've been advised I no longer need to recuse myself, so I will participate in the conversation and voting.

Glad to have you here to vote. Okay, so, um, Any other comments from the council? All right, so this is a public hearing. We'll open it up to the public. Anyone who would like to make public comments, welcome to do so. Please hold your comments to 3 minutes and give us your name when you approach the podium. Seeing how no one is coming forward, we'll close the public comment portion of the public hearing and bring it back to the council. Any other comments or questions from Okay, I would take a motion on this if someone would like to make it.

Mayor, I'd recommend that City Council by ordinance amend Section 22-5-A zoning map of the City of Orem by changing the zoning of approximately the 7.89 acres of property located at the 759 East Timpano Nogués Parkway generally from the PD-6 zone to the PRD zone, and then amend Appendix KK of the Orem City Code by adding Abbey Road Townhomes PRD concept plan and the elevations.

And is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilmember Lentz.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye. Okay, the ordinance passes. I don't think there's any other things on. Well, thank you very much. Appreciate it. We'll now move to 10.4, which is a public hearing, an ordinance amending Appendix KK of the Orem City Code for Baxter Gardens with an updated concept plan and elevations for the property located at 195 East, 1600 North in the PRD zone. And Grant Allen is our presenter. Is the applicant here for this? Okay, if you could come forward and introduce yourself.

Good evening, Council.

My name's Lon Lewis.

I live in Pleasant Grove. Okay.

All right, Grant, we'll turn the time over to you.

Great, thanks, Mayor. So this— the applicant is requesting the City Council amend the previously approved concept plan and elevations for Baxter Gardens located at this location here shown. And that was approved on August 28th, 2018. And the council approved the concept plan, shows a total of 6 units on the property. And I've shown that here from Appendix KK that's currently in the code.

Thank you.

As well as the approved elevations from that August 28th meeting. The applicant is— would like to amend the concept plan for construction of 10 units on the property instead of the previously approved 6 units. The PRD zone allows up to 7 units with a bonus for up to 8 units when the existing structure is removed. There is an existing structure On the— shown here. And the Bastyr Family Trust initially sought to amend the concept plan with 13 units. Through neighborhood meeting process they had, they were willing to compromise with the neighbors and not only on the number of units but also the stories. It was originally proposed to be 2-storey units. And the PRD ordinance also, just as a note, was updated in February '19 to allow the City Council discretion in approving modifications to previously approved concept plans. So City Council is not obligated to approve even if it meets the requirements. But to show that, this is the Proposed concept plan with the 10 units, single-story units. There's also a reservation here, a street dedication in the favor of the City of Orem, if this property to the west were to ever future develop, or also for the current owners to have access to their property. And then we have the proposed elevations that we're amending the concept plan. Planning Commission recommended that this was— be approved, and staff supports that recommendation.

So it appears the cul-de-sac will be completed rather than be a half a cul-de-sac road itself. So you'll have the full turnaround there. And will these have basements?

Yes, they will.

Okay. And what are the square footage amounts of each one on average?

We have several different floor plans, but they're approximately 1,600 feet plus a basement.

Okay.

And then approximately what are they selling for?

We haven't determined that. We're still trying to do market studies, whatnot.

So Do you have a ballpark idea or not really?

It's hard to say, but we would suggest in the high 3s.

Okay.

Councilmember Luria has a question for you.

Yes.

I used to live in this neighborhood, but I've since moved away. I know at one point there was some concern, but it sounds like in talking to people you have lowered it and you have met some of the neighborhood's concerns. Can you give me an idea when you met with the neighborhood, were they happy with this? Were they generally supportive of it?

The initial reaction, it was very negative, and— but we had proposed something different than what we're proposing currently. The density was higher and 2-story units, and it was a start, and we took the feedback from the neighbors and was able to make a compromise to what you see And I believe that there were 3 people at the Planning Commission that were from my neighborhood.

I unfortunately had to leave, so I didn't get to hear their comments. But were they generally, Steve, positive?

My recollection is that they were. Yeah, they were satisfied with this proposal and happy that the developer was willing to compromise from what he originally proposed.

OK. And the 3 gentlemen that came were the people that probably have been most involved. So if they were happy with it, I would be happy.

Councilmember Seestrand has a question.

Thank you. Just, you know, from a historical perspective of being on the council for a while, it seems like there's been a number of occasions where originally there's a plan, a concept plan done, and then a new developer comes and tries to ratchet it up and get a little bit more out of it, and another developer comes. And I've always been curious as to what was wrong with the initial Proposal that was approved recently by the City Council. Why is that not a developable plan or a worthwhile plan that was already kind of gone through the process?

I'm not sure the history or why the Baxters proposed what they did, but I do know that as we did our due diligence and looked into numbers and the ability to successfully develop it, the density just didn't work. And there was the issue of the half cul-de-sac, and I think there were several issues out there that made it difficult to proceed with based upon their application.

Oh, you think how they proposed it was undevelopable then, in that— according to the original plan?

Well, I think they had a different product. I think their Their footprints were larger. The density was less. The cul-de-sac didn't work. I think there were discussions about the neighbors and their ability to access property. I really—I can't speak for them. I don't know. I do know that, in my opinion, based upon what they had proposed, it wasn't successful, and I. believe there's 2 or 3 more developers out there that would give you the same recommendation.

So as I look at this, then I kind of ask the kind of follow-up question is, so this plan, is this better for the developer? Is this a better plan for the developer than the previous one?

It makes it so I can make it work and make it develop. Based upon 6 units, it wouldn't be successful for me.

And is this current proposal a better plan than the previous one for the neighbors and/or the city?

I know the neighbors are in favor of it. They've expressed, you know, if this is going to develop, this will work for them. They'd be satisfied with it. Truthfully, I think most people would say don't develop, but I do know we have them on our side. Not that it's a, you know, they're in support of it. And so we feel comfortable with it.

OK.

Thank you.

You bet.

Councilmember Lentz has a comment.

Do you have— and it's up on the screen, but it's so small I can't really see it. I'm not sure if you can— if you have a better image of the cul-de-sac cross-section and the street cross-section. The reason Yeah, that might actually work. Will there be parking on both sides of that street going back there? And the reason I'm asking that is, is that going to be too much of a pinch point if, you know, some— if one of the neighbors has a party back there and they've got a bunch of family or friends over, is it going to be difficult for the guy that's in Lot 9 to get back to his property if people are parked on all sides of that street?

Roger, do you want to help me?

I don't know what the ordinance is. If— I believe parking's allowed, but he's the designer and would know car turnarounds.

And, and will there be an HOA with this project?

A which? HOA?

HOA.

Yes.

Yep, there.

Okay.

This is a standard sublocal street, one that we've used numerous times in Orem. The legacy The Ridge project on the Urquhart property on 2000 South has this same cross-section. So it's our standard sub-local street cross-section.

Yeah.

And if, if for whatever reason the HOA decided a couple years, you know what, it is getting to be too much of a pinch point, can the HOA just decide, hey, we're going to red curb one side of that to give us more space? Or is that— does that have to be a city decision?

It's a public street. And so that'd have to be a committee decision, I believe. Yeah.

Thank you.

Councilor McDonald has a comment.

Yes, when we— we had a fairly heated discussion, and maybe some of the neighbors will feel this is much better than we did before, but at one point you showed, can you A/B it? There was one that was going into this other piece of land to the west. That plan was never approved. The people who currently own that home in front, etc., aren't developing at this time. Likely they will develop down the road, but they're— at this point they're not developing. Will the plan we're approving for this piece of property on the east allow the property on the west to be developed without major problems?

Yes, as it went through the review committee process, that was one of the major issues we addressed was Yes. Was one, the cul-de-sac, that it was— the original proposal as it came through was similar to the one I showed before, had the cul-de-sac going over onto the neighboring property. And we guided— from the engineering, we guided them to place it on the property. And then also, as I mentioned, to show— just to see if I could zoom in here. This cross-hatched area is, is a street easement in the favor of City of Orem for, for the guarantee of that neighboring property owner currently to access their property in the back. As we've heard, they currently use it back there, I believe, for horses. And also, if it were to develop for that reason, to be able to be accessed.

Is that back piece landlocked? I thought it was owned by the same person who owns the front piece.

No?

It's 2 brothers.

Brothers.

OK. So they're family, but have rights to go in. So if someday that home goes away, the family home that's been there for many, many years, it would just allow kind of a loop road to have an ingress and a regress? Or would they all— I don't know what you're— it's really not our job to plan the next development, I understand. I just want to make sure it's plausible.

I believe the original proposal was— if I can make this work here— was potentially to have some more units here in the short term. I'm not quite sure about this parcel in the front here in terms of what the access would be, but that is why we, as part of the process, we had them do that easement in favor.

Our solution will allow them to do something in the future, correct, plans that would work within it. Looks like the Planning Commission was rattling heads as well. Thank you.

Councillor Seestrand has a comment.

Me again, just verifying, all the landscaping along the cul-de-sac and the— towards the west side of the street there, will that all be done by the HOA?

I believe that was part of the review process as well, so yes.

Thank you.

All right, this is a public hearing, so we'll go ahead and open it up to the public. Anyone wishing to come and make comments is welcome to do so. Keep your comments to 3 minutes and give us your name. Seeing as how no one's coming forward, we'll close the public comment portion of the public hearing. Any further comments from the council?

Hi, are there any neighbors that are here?

Okay, so I am open to a motion on this ordinance. Councilmember Sumner? Yes, go ahead. You've got to turn that on.

Make a motion that we— is that on?

It's on.

Make a motion we approve the ordinance amending Appendix KKK of the Orem City Code for Baxter Gardens with an updated concept Plan and elevations for the property located at 195 East 1600 North in the PRD zone.

It is Appendix KK, not KKK. Okay.

Now that we've made that correction, I'll second it.

So don't kick me off the council for that.

So you would amend that to— or Appendix KK.

Okay.

Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilor McDonald.

Aye.

Aye. Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Okay, the ordinance passes. Thank you very much. We now want to go on to 10.5, which is also a public hearing. This is an ordinance amending Section 17-8-2F of the Orem City Code by removing Section 7010 of the Uniform Building Code and adding Chapter 18, Sections 1803 and 1804 of the International Building Codes as a reference. Our presenter is Grant Allen.

Thank you, Mayor. So the Development Services is requesting City Council amend Orem City Code. The current wording of the code for our hillside developments portion of our subdivision ordinance is referencing an outdated code, so we are updating that to this current state adopted code, which is Chapter 18, Sections 1803 and 1804 of the International Building Code. So the Planning Commission recommended that the City Council amend this section, and staff supports the Planning Commission. So just to show you that.

I apologize.

All right. Any questions from the council? All right. If not, this is a—

I'm sorry.

Councilmember Lentz.

Sam, maybe you could speak to this. With this being, I think, specific to hillside developments, has this been relevant for any recent projects that we've had in the city? Does this allow us to do anything, or is this basically just a We need to clean up the code to comply with state code.

Yeah, it's just—

it's more or less just a cleanup because it's referencing a code that isn't existing anymore.

So it's mainly just cleanup.

Okay, thank you.

All right, this is a public hearing, so we'll open it up to the public. Anyone wishing to come forward, please give us your name and hold your comments to 3 minutes. Seeing as how no one's coming forward, we'll close the public comment portion of the public hearing and bring it back to the council. Any further comments or questions from the council? All right, I am open to a motion.

I move that we amend Section 1782F of the Orem City Code by removing Section 7010 of the Uniform Building Code, adding Chapter 18 Sections 1803 and 1804 of the International Building Codes as a reference.

Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilmember Lentz.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Okay, the ordinance passes. Move on to item number 10.6. This is a resolution, not a public hearing, in regards to a site plan approval of Golden Pond at Sleepy Ridge, Phase Number 7, located generally at 1900 West Golden Pond Way in the PD-15 zone. Is the applicant here? If you'd like to come forward. And if you could introduce yourself.

Boyd Brown. Thank you, Mr. Mayor and council.

So, Grant, if you'd like to go over this for us.

So I've got here the location map of this parcel. The applicant's seeking to develop this parcel with 8 twin homes, and the PD-15 zone requires City Council approval for site plans in this zone. Units 1 through 6 are 2-story twin homes. I'll just I kind of skipped through to show you some elevations there of the units 1 through 6, as well as units 7 and 8 are one-story homes, as shown here. Go back to the site plan. The zone requires 2.5 stalls per unit for a total parking of 20 stalls. Site is providing 28 stalls. Go back.

Yes.

Units 1 through 6 are 30 feet tall with brick and siding. Units 7 and 8 are one-story units, again, with stucco siding and stucco finish. The landscaping and overall plan comply with the PD-15 zone requirements as it has gone through committee review process. The additional note of this was that the HOA The Golden Pond at Sleepy Ridge is approved. The addition is part of the existing HOA that was approved, provided as part of the packet of the agenda. And then the neighborhood meeting was held in May prior to the Planning Commission meeting. In addition, the— as we talked with the applicant about neighborhood meetings, It was addressed that there is multiple opportunities for members of the HOA to find out about this proposed project, as they had held several meetings prior to the May meeting. Because the site plan is in the PD-15 zone, it was also required to hold a neighbourhood meeting. And the Planning Commission recommended the City Council approve the site plan. So staff supports the Planning Commission.

So a couple questions for the applicant. If you could tell me what the square footage of these units are, how many bedrooms, and are there basements?

Yes, we're planning on doing basements in the townhomes, units 1 through 6.

No basements in 7 and 8?

No, I'm sorry, 1 through 6, we're not sure if they're going to have basements or not. We've done a soils report to do We determined that we could put basements in. So with that design, if it's no basements, it would be about 1,600 to 1,700 square feet. The end units would be a little bit larger of finished square footage, all above grade. And if we did put a basement underneath, it would be about another 450 square feet for a total of about 2,100 square feet. The design on the units 1 through 6 have 3 bedrooms and 2 baths on the upper level and just a living area And a half bath on the main floor. Units 7 and 8— and that's very consistent with the size and the—

Sure.

Bed and bath layout with the rest of the subdivision. Units 7 and 8 really is more of a senior type of a product, and those are designed currently as 2 bedrooms on the main with a flex space that I guess could be used as a small bedroom but more of an office. And I believe those are Gosh, they're a big unit. I want to say that they're about 1,900 square feet finished on the main floor. Again, very similar to the footprint of the surrounding properties that are of that style. And we are planning on putting full basements on there. They will have a walkout basement, and I don't know that we'll deliver that as a finished basement or unfinished at this point.

And 1 through 6, about what are they going to sell for?

Hard to keep up with the market and the cost right now. It just— everything keeps escalating. My guess, based on some recent sales in that area, will probably be in that $319,000 to $369,000. Our experience is that the end units will be a little higher. This product is a little bit unique with the rear load garage. We also— we are doing a deck above the garage that is walkout, which will have a nice view over the pond.

Sure.

That'll be a nice selling feature, but I don't know that we're— I mean, we're trying to stay current on all the cost of building, but that's our best pricing. The large ones, the 7 and 8, those are that real premium lot. And generally, the Ramblers will pay— will sell for a little bit more cost of construction. That is a bigger unit. My guess is they're going to be probably closer to $400,000.

Okay, and then can you go back A slide. Okay. You know, I don't need to bring this up, I wouldn't think, but you realize what your— where your location is and the proximity to the wastewater treatment plant. And just, you know that, I guess.

We do know that, and that's—

And we work very hard to keep the— any odors down, but when you're right next door, just— anyway.

Yeah, generally we have to sell against things like that— power lines, wastewater treatments. We don't have people requesting to be in that location, but I— we've made the bet that the additional amenity—

Sure.

—way will overcome that.

Sure.

But we— if we had our preference of neighbors, we'd probably pick another one.

Councilmember Luria has a comment.

I actually moved to this neighborhood, and I just wanted to report that there have been no negative reports to me from anyone being upset at this. Or this— this area has a good mix of single-family homes as well as more of this product, and so I think it will blend in the neighborhood. So, but I do want to report that it's supported by the neighbors.

Councilmember Lentz has a comment.

The body of water that comes there, that's connected directly to Utah Lake or part of Utah Lake, right? That's not just a pond or— That is a pond. Yeah, okay. So you're kind of sandwiched between the wastewater plant and the golf course there, kind of diametrically opposed uses. But as far as the basements go, is that part of Like a HUD flood zone there that has— like, are there extra hoops that you need to jump through to safeguard those basements against any kind of protections there?

None that we're aware of. We've researched that as well as we could. There's nothing on the title. There's nothing that's come up in our research. And we did have multiple soils tests done. I think the biggest concern for us was the depth of the water level there. And if you look at the rest of the neighborhood, the homes next to us do all have basements. But we did the research, and to this point, we haven't found that there's any floodplain or any other restrictions.

Thank you.

Any other comments from the council? Questions? Okay. Well, this is not a public hearing. This is strictly a site plan approval. So would anyone like to make a motion? Councilmember Leary.

I move by resolution that we approve the site plan of Golden Pond at Sleepy Ridge Phase 7, located generally at 1900 West Golden Pond Way in the PD-15 zone.

Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilmember McDonald.

Mr. Mayor.

Yes.

I'm sorry, this is not a public hearing, so there is not an opportunity for you to speak. This is strictly a resolution for a site plan approval, so the opportunity to speak is not part of this. So this is a site plan approval, so it's not— we're not changing the zone. It's already an approved zone. And you could have spoken when the zone was approved, but at this point the zone has already been approved and this is strictly a site plan approval, and so there is no public hearing. I apologize.

And is something like that—

Well, you'll have to talk to staff as far as site—

Mayor, if I may, just to revisit this issue. This matter was actually scheduled and noticed before the Planning Commission, and a public hearing was held at that point. So there has been public comment that has been taken on this matter, and it was appropriately noticed to surrounding neighbours.

Okay, thank you. Yes. So I'm sorry, that's not available to you. This is strictly a site plan approval resolution that could have been done in the Planning Commission. And but— So staff, I believe that— Child of my father, Gary McTaggart, whose land that you are deciding on to be purchased. Uh, sure, I respect that. You're welcome to give a copy of the letter to the council members, but that we are not having a public hearing on it.

So, um, If I may now, Mr. Boyd, you are the, the owner of record on this property.

I'm not. The Clegg family, through their estate, who's under contract to sell it to me and has been for more than a year. So I mean, this is the first time I've met this woman. I haven't met her yet, but we're working through an attorney through the estate.

So the estate did in fact sell you this property?

It's through an attorney. I mean, again, this has been ongoing, but I'm the second buyer on this. It's been going on a half—

It sounds like they know about it. Sounds like a conversation needs to be had with the trustee of the Clegg estate since that transaction took place a year ago.

Also, the— most of these neighbors were at the public hearing, and they've been involved in meetings with me for over a year now. I had a neighborhood meeting. I mean, we've discussed— they certainly are opposed to some of the—

And I understand. I'm just trying to ascertain who, in fact, can legally negotiate sale of a property and From what you're representing to me, the trust has sold or is selling the interest of this property to you.

Yes.

And Sam, I don't know whether you can answer this, but I believe that notification was sent out within a certain area around the property. I think it's 500 feet. Okay? So it has been before the Planning Commission. It has been noticed. And this is strictly a site plan approval. So we will still go ahead with this. So I appreciate that. Respectfully, that time has come and gone for you to make those comments. And those comments could have been made and were available in a previous meeting. So in this meeting, we're holding a resolution, and we're going to go ahead and move ahead with the resolution.

I know people who were there who had the impression that we're not planning to vote on this.

So I was not at the—

About an hour-long public hearing with these same neighbors. At least an hour.

So there was a public hearing held. I'm aware of that.

Well, Mayor, just to be clear, it was the— at the Planning Commission, it was actually still just a public meeting.

OK.

So the Planning Commission was not required to take comment at that time. They elected to do that.

OK.

And allow the neighbors to voice their concerns. And I think as Grant indicated that did go on for a lengthy period of time. I— my belief was that everyone who wanted to speak had an opportunity to speak at the Planning Commission. Mickey was here. He's on the Planning Commission. And I think he would confirm that as well. So I don't think that they were— they were limited in the amount of time that they were allotted to speak. Everyone who wanted to could have the opportunity to do so.

OK.

Well, with that, we'll go ahead with a motion. I have a motion. I know, you just have to wait a second, Tom. And you made it, and I believe there's a second for it. Has there been a second?

I second it.

Dave seconded it. So we'll go ahead with a vote on it, and we'll start with Councilmember Lentz.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye. Aye.

Okay, the resolution passes. Thank you very much. We'll move on to 10.7, which is a resolution for a conditional use permit approval for an accessory structure of 1,776 square feet located at 466 East 1,500 North in the PD-14 zone. And our presenter is Grant Allen.

Thank you, Mayor. So, as background, any accessory structure in the That's greater than 1,000 square feet in the PD-14 zone requires conditional use permit approval from the City Council. This is the— I've highlighted here the location and the current zoning map showing the parcel. This is an accessory building with a living room, bedroom, 2-car garage, guest house, also pool equipment and—

Pool equipment.

for a pool house. The lot contains a total area of 41,468 square feet or 0.95 acres. The accessory building contains 1,776 square feet on 2 levels. It's covering 4% of the lot.

Okay.

And the height of the structure at 22 feet is well below the maximum height of 43 feet allowed in the zone. And then it's consisting of stucco and wood siding. And the— just to show some of the site here, as well as the floor plans. And then the overall landscaping and site plan meets the requirements of the PD-14 zone. The Planning Commission forwarded upon a positive recommendation to the City Council to approve this, and staff supports that recommendation.

So I'm trying to find my way around the— yeah, if you could go back. So that's the existing structure, and then can you go to how they're going to do that?

There you have it, right? So existing structure here, and then the proposed accessory building there. Let me zoom in a little bit, then maybe that helps.

Okay.

So a question is, I'm told by Councilmember Spencer that they're already digging the pool, which I don't believe is allowed because we have not given a conditional use permit yet. Is the applicant here? Could you come forward? Can you have a seat? Tell us who you are.

My name is Wes Holcomb.

Thank you, Mayor.

And are you a contractor on this?

Sir.

And are you already digging the pool?

Well, they actually—

the pool contractor has pulled his own permit, if I'm not mistaken.

Pulled his permit.

Is he here?

No, sir.

Okay.

And that wasn't sort of on us. That was the pool contractor. Because it's— the pool's already built, I think.

It's not.

It's Currently being done.

But that's not part of what we're voting on, right?

This is a conditional use permit for an accessory structure.

Yes, sir.

So it's not necessarily the pool, right? But my question was if the pool's being dug.

The pool is being dug.

Okay. Councilor McDonald, you had a question?

So I'm guessing that the pool doesn't need approval, but the building does. Is that correct? Staff, can you help me with that? They can build an outdoor pool. It's covering the structure that needs the approval.

It's a conditional use permit for the structure, not the pool.

That's what we're approving.

That's what we're discussing.

The pool, they didn't need a—

No, no, I agree. I was just asking the question if they're digging the pool.

Yes, sir.

Okay. Okay, any questions from the council? Councilmember Lentz.

So I didn't see that there was a kitchen included, so I'm guessing this is not intended to be like an accessory rented out as a residence, correct? It's basically just kind of treated like an extension of the house if somebody's staying, or—

That's correct.

The family has 9 kids and they're venturing out a little bit.

Okay, thank you.

Okay, any other questions? I don't have any questions. With that, I would accept a motion to— for the resolution.

Sorry, one more question. So if somebody wanted to do this in kind of a standard R-8 zone or something like that, would they need this type of permit, or is that specific to the PD zone? I'm just—

from a procedural So in this particular case, it's specific to this PD zone. It allows for an accessory dwelling, basically a detached accessory dwelling, where most residential zones wouldn't allow for that. So, and it also probably a size bonus that other zones wouldn't typically have.

Is it— when I first saw this on our agenda, I thought it was kind of odd that it would come to the City Council to approve a pool house. kind of thing. I mean, I—

Yeah, and it's because they're allowed to be so much larger than the typical that they're treated as conditional uses so they can be reviewed and approved by the council.

Okay.

Thank you. One thing I might mention, these lots are bigger than your norm.

Yeah.

And many of these homes have accessory structures in them. So would someone care to make a motion?

Sure, I'd like to make a motion. Mayor, I move that the city council Grant a use permit—

Conditional use.

A conditional use permit approval for an accessory structure of 1,776 square feet located at 466 East 1500 North in the PD-14 zone.

Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, we'll start with Councilmember Lentz.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Okay, the resolution passes. Thank you.

Thank you, Mayor.

Any items from the city manager? Okay, so we will go ahead. I move that we adjourn to a closed-door meeting for city manager evaluation in room 107. Is there a second?

Second.

Okay, all in favor say aye.

Aye.

Okay, this meeting is adjourned.

Thank you.

Thank you, Grant.